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Featured Guide To The Post Tribulation

Discussion in 'Eschatology & Prophecy Forum' started by Avalon1, Jun 22, 2020.

  1. Timtofly

    Timtofly Active Member

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    The tribulation is the period leading up to the last day. This last day; this Day of the Lord is 1000 years long on earth. Armageddon is the first hour, Gog and Megog the last hour. Then the GWT. If one rejects the 1000 year point of a Lord's Day; they, not those who accept the truth, have to figure out time. If all are killed in the morning, it is a 20 hr miracle where billions more are killed in the Gog Megog battle. Isaiah 65 happens miraculously in 20 hours.
     
  2. Keraz

    Keraz Well-Known Member

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    Joke!
    The normal way of saying that epithet is; 'You can't see the trees for the forest'.
    And that is your problem, you look at the Return of Jesus and fail to see what must happen before that Day.
    Yes, we all read our Bibles.
    The problem is when people jump to wrong conclusions about what the prophets are saying.

    In 1 Corinthians 15, there are several time markers. Verse 24 confirms the Millennium reign of Jesus, fitting in with Revelation 20 to 21:1-7.
    Then in verse 54-55 Paul says people will receive immortality and Death will be no more. He does not say when this will happen. We find that in Revelation 21:4, which is after the Great White Throne Judgment, after the Book of Life is opened.
    So any teaching that such a thing as 'glorified bodies' or immortality comes to anyone before then, is wrong and is false teaching.
    We Christians have the Promise, John 3:16, +, but the reality isn't for more than a thousand years yet!
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020
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  3. Naomi25

    Naomi25 Well-Known Member

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    "IF I had read them". There's that amazing assumption...or presumption again.
    Here's the deal Bobby. You're the one making the claims about these verses. Do you know what that means? That means the onus is upon YOU to prove that they say what you claim they do. So, hows about this: you list out these verses and go through them line by line for us and point out exactly how they line up with the events you claim they do. I'd very much like to see you do that...if you can.
    However, if you either cannot do it, or will not...then do NOT expect anyone to take you OR your claims about these verses seriously. It's that simple. If you claim it, teach it. If you can't, be silent.
     
  4. Bobby Jo

    Bobby Jo Well-Known Member

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    No assumption, it's pretty obvious that you don't want to know what these Chapters and Verses say, so you defer YOUR RESPONSIBILITY so you can nit-pick every word, every observation, and every argument that you want me make.

    However, I have no argument to make. If you hate GOD's Word so much that you REFUSE to read it in context with modern history, then your blood is on your own head. -- And personally, I don't even care! I've done my due diligence and anything more is up to you -- OR NOT.

    Bobby Jo
     
  5. Jay Ross

    Jay Ross Well-Known Member

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    Bobby, I have consulted Ps 26 & 48 with our modern history and I did not discern in those Psalms, any indication of the following prophecies occurring.

    Ps 26 does not mention that Babylon will be remembers again after being desolated and devastated for a period of around 2,000 years.

    PS 48 does not mention that Jerusalem was partitioned into three areas to be administered by three outside powers, i.e. Brittian, Jordan and the U.N.

    Both of this prophecies are found Revelation 16:17-21 but they are not mentioned in either Psalm. Perhaps you may like to confirm that this is true.

    In which case the theory that each of the Psalm's "chapters" reflect the History of the Middle East from 1901 from to 2050 where the chapter number is added to the year 1900 AD is not true as you are suggesting.

    Perhaps the theory as you are attesting to is not true.

    Shalom
     
  6. Avalon1

    Avalon1 Active Member

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    So we're all evil sinners if we don't agree with you? Is that how it works?
     
  7. Naomi25

    Naomi25 Well-Known Member

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    See, this is fairly laughable, for two reasons. One...it is literally impossible for you to prove I haven't read those verses. And since I have, in fact, read them, it actually makes you 100% wrong. You, therefore, are making a claim about me that is basically false witness. But, you know, go ahead, it makes you look rather lacking in character.
    Secondly, it is a logical fact that those who make a claim, must back it up. If I stood up here and claimed "The bible says that the angels are actually aliens!" Everyone would...quite rightfully say: "prove it". And to have my idea in anyway verified, I would need to carefully prove it from scripture.
    Any muppet can go online and say "this is the truth!". If they are not even willing to TRY and back it up, why on earth would they think anyone would waste a moment of their time considering their scheme?
    Basically? This is not even about me or what you want to claim about me or my character or what I have or have not read or done with my time. It's simply about what you can back up or whether or not your even willing to try. Your actions speak louder than words.
     
  8. Bobby Jo

    Bobby Jo Well-Known Member

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    Scripture says to "try the spirits" and see if they be of GOD. But nobody has to. They can deny Scripture, can deny Jesus, and can deny GOD.

    Do you deny Scripture? Have you read the 19th Book of the Bible to see of the Chapters are prophetic for the 1900's, -- or do you just scoff?
    Bobby Jo
     
  9. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member

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    It's right there in 1 Thessalonians 4:16, the raising of the dead in Christ. That resurrection does not happen prior to the tribulation.
     
  10. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member

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    No, not really. I personally have never... heard the complete 1 Corinthians 15 chapter taught in a Church. Only selective bits and pieces are pulled from it, and the part Paul taught about the body of incorruption being a "spiritual body" is usually just passed over.
     
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  11. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member

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    That's just silly, it shows that you cannot even discern a simple expression.
     
  12. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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  13. Naomi25

    Naomi25 Well-Known Member

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    And that was a very...bizarre word for you to choose to focus on to 'disagree' with.
    Yes "us" is a general term, it was meant to be. Can you deny that Revelation shows, repeatedly that Christians are martyred for their faith, but by their very death they actually are triumphing over their enemies...much like their Saviour did?
    In this way, whether we live for Christ or die for Christ, we triumph over Satan and his works.


    Also it was allowed to make war on the saints and to conquer them. And authority was given it over every tribe and people and language and nation, -Revelation 13:7

    And when they have finished their testimony, the beast that rises from the bottomless pit will make war on them and conquer them and kill them, -Revelation 11:7

    And they have conquered him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, for they loved not their lives even unto death. -Revelation 12:11

    Then I saw another sign in heaven, great and amazing...And I saw what appeared to be a sea of glass mingled with fire—and also those who had conquered the beast and its image and the number of its name, standing beside the sea of glass with harps of God in their hands. -Revelation 15:1a,2


    Yes...an no. Salvation is both something we receive from Christ when we are Justified; when our hearts are made new in the our acceptance of his blood spilled in our place.
    However, there is evidence in scripture that 'salvation' is also a daily wrestling on our behalf in some way. It is, of course, in conjunction with the Spirits work within us. We could call it sanctification, this ongoing walk of salvation.

    Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure. -Philippians 2:12–13

    And he said to all, “If anyone would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow me. For whoever would save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for my sake will save it. -Luke 9:23–24


    As have I. But I fully acknowledge that a day might come when the Lord might call me into martyrdom. Or any number of other things. Like Job, we cannot know the battle raging in the spiritual places, and that is what Revelation is showing most heavily; the out-workings on earth of that spiritual raging. We may only see the pestilence, the earthquakes, the evil men doing evil things, but anyone who believes in God knows that there is a very real spiritual realm and war going on behind most things. This is why, when we see our brothers and sisters in Christ in the Middle East martyred most horribly, we grieve for them, but we know with utmost certainty that they were met on the other side with the phrase "well done good and faithful servant!" They stood firm in their faith even to the point of death! They will be rewarded with the crown of life and a given a white robe to wear. waiting for that moment when those who tormented and killed them will face the ultimate Judge of everything.

    Uh, yeah, see above, that's kind of the point.

    I too believe everyone will stand before the Judgement seat of God. Thus, the books shall be opened. Where we spend eternity and how we are judged will depend on which book our names are found it.

    But yes, it appears we see things very differently. It's interesting, isn't it, how people can read the same texts and come away with very different takes?
     
  14. Anthony D'Arienzo

    Anthony D'Arienzo Well-Known Member

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    Some say it was written by 66ad
     
  15. Anthony D'Arienzo

    Anthony D'Arienzo Well-Known Member

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    When the bible says God owns the cattle on a 1000 hills, does that mean he does not own the cattle on hill 1001, 1002?
     
  16. Bobby Jo

    Bobby Jo Well-Known Member

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    Re-Post:



    Bobby Jo said:
    Scripture says to "try the spirits" and see if they be of GOD. But nobody has to. They can deny Scripture, can deny Jesus, and can deny GOD.

    Do you deny Scripture? Have you read the 19th Book of the Bible to see of the Chapters are prophetic for the 1900's, -- or do you just scoff?
    Bobby Jo

    @Avalon1,

    Do you only make unsubstantiated accusations, and then run like a little girl when challenged with what you SHOULD HAVE INVESTIGATED?!?

    It THAT Christianity?
    Bobby Jo
     
  17. Timtofly

    Timtofly Active Member

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    No, it means you only see 50 hills. God sees the rest.
     
  18. Avalon1

    Avalon1 Active Member

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    If you want to see all my research and points all of which is fully cited with scripture I suggest that you go back and read my post on page 1. Otherwise we don't have anything more to discuss.
     
  19. Naomi25

    Naomi25 Well-Known Member

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    Quit trying to make other people prove YOUR idea false, especially before you've even attempted to prove it correct in the first place. As i've mentioned before...and you rather neatly dodged...the onus is upon YOU to back up your claims. When you make zero attempt to, no one needs spend one second giving you or your claims a moments worth of consideration. You call others "little girls" when they choose to disagree with you. You don't seem to realize that when you consistently side-step explaining YOUR OWN idea or validate it via scripture, choosing instead to insult those who take the cautious "please show me this through scriptural proof" tack...which is itself biblical...you prove to all here that not only is your reasoning faulty, but they shouldn't listen to a single thing you have to say.
    Simply put: you are, in fact, being your own worst enemy.
     
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  20. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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    US, being General, gives NO indication WHO is the "Specific US".

    You have decided the "US" IS Christians.
    Scripture never mentions Christians IN Revelations.

    The word Christian...was devised BY non-believers, Calling other men WHO believed AND other men WHO were Following Christ's teachings.

    Major Religions TODAY are Very Confusing.
    (A topic for another Time).
    But for the word "Christian" as used "Today"...
    * Men believing AND Following...(who Can fall away an stop Believing and Following)...are called Christians.
    * Men believing AND Following AND Converted...(who CAN NOT fall away)...are called Christians.
    * YET ...Jesus defined THEM Specifically "AS "
    "Converted" IN Christ.

    BY their Very Death?
    Physical Death Does NOT Save men.
    "Conversion", Crucified With Christ, Saves and Quickens men to Everlasting Life.
    The "Conversion", IS the Triumph, (Not armies of men killing men,) IN Keeping the Credit TO Christ, (not an Army who kills physical bodies).

    I would say ISRAEL for ancient TO modern history have been (In Bondage, Slaves, Outcasts, Tortured, Martyred) Expressly for Their Faith IN the Heavenly God.
    AND a primary factor, why, those of the Tribes of Judah and Benjamin, who were coming To Jesus; STOPPED Believing and following After Jesus the Christ, not many years After the Apostals Of Christ died off).

    Killing of Converted Christians, For their Faith IN Christ Jesus, is a more modern and Isolated, (to specific regions), NOT World wide.


    * IT ? - Yes - The Beast (World Authority Govt)
    ( under government control of A Worshiped "false god"; the dragon/(Satan/Devil/anti-Christ/Likeness as a man/all one in the same).
    * ALLOWED ?- Yes - BY Whom? The Lamb of God.
    * WHEN ? - Beginning of Tribulation. Opening of the First FOUR SEALS, BY the Lamb of God.
    * AUTHORITY ? - Yes - BY Whom? The Power of God.
    * WHO IS THE Power of God? - CHRIST.
    * IT - Beast & false god, Given Power & Authority TO MAKE War ON "THEM".
    * THEM ? - who?- "Saints".
    * what "Saints"?
    * Who are "these" Saints?
    * Why are "they called" Saints?
    * Where are "these" Saints?
    THE SAINTS:
    * Saints: OT/ men Faithful To God and His Word...Saved...at their Physical Death.
    * Saints: NT/ ISRAEL men REMAINING UNDER OT LAW/ Remaining Faithful to God and His Word: Saved at Physical Death: (thereafter, called a Saint).
    * During Tribulation- ISRAEL (Gods People) SENT Servants To Teach ISRAEL...JESUS IS "their" (the 12 Tribes) Christ Messiah Savior.
    JESUS "IS" the Word of God.
    CHRIST "IS" the Power of God.
    Christ Jesus "IS" "their" (12 Tribes/ISRAEL) "Salvation"...BEFORE Physical Death.
    * Sainthood- ALIVE in their FLESH, ON Earth- - CONVERTED IN Christ- BEFORE Physical Death.
    ALSO - the Same Applies TO ANY Gentile- During the Tribulation-
    ALIVE IN their FLESH- ON Earth- Electing to Believe IN God, IN Christ Jesus- becoming "Converted" IN Christ...
    ARE the Saints, ON Earth, ALIVE IN their Flesh, ALLOWED TO BE Physically KILLED, BY the Power given the Dragon/Satan and The Army under the Authority OF Satan.

    No, I will not BE ON Earth During the Tribulation..."Coming INTO Belief, IN God, IN Christ Jesus, Converting, Becoming a Saint, and THEN being Allowed "By the Lamb of God," TO BE Killed BY the Power given Satan.

    I have Already Established with the Lord God, my Belief IN Him...I have Already GIVEN my Life To Him...His Power has Already MADE me Converted...I am Already EXCEPTED FROM Satan TAKING / KILLING my Physical Life. <-- My Physical Life was Already "by me", GIVEN TO Christ Jesus.

    Continued to Your next point.

    Glory to God,
    Taken


     
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