Should the meaning of Greek words affect the interpretation of the passages they are found in?

[Zao is life]

Take a look at the following three Greek words:

1. érgon (Strongs Greek 02041)

Throughout the New Testament and without exception, érgon (works) always refers to the works of God / Christ, or of men, or of Satan (the vast majority of times it refers to the works of men):-

Works of Christ and of God the Father:-

Matthew 11:2; Luke 24:19; John 4:34; John 5:20; John 5:36; John 6:28; John 6:29; John 7:3; John 7:21; John 9:3; John 9:4; John 10:25; John 10:32; John 10:33; John 10:37; John 10:38; John 14:10; John 14:11; John 14:12; John 15:24; John 17:4; Acts 13:41; Acts 15:18; Romans 14:20; Philippians 1:6; Hebrews 1:10; Hebrews 2:7; Hebrews 3:9; Hebrews 4:3; Hebrews 4:4; Revelation 15:3.

Works of darkness or of Satan:-

Romans 13:12; II Corinthians 11:15; Ephesians 5:11; I John 3:8.

Works of men:-

Matthew 5:16; Matthew 23:3; Matthew 23:5; Matthew 26:10; Mark 13:34; Mark 14:6; Luke 11:48; John 3:19; John 3:20; John 3:21; John 7:7; John 8:39; John 8:41; Acts 5:38; Acts 7:22; Acts 7:41; Acts 9:36; Acts 13:2; Acts 14:26; Acts 15:38; Acts 26:20; Titus 2:14; Romans 2:6; Romans 2:7; Romans 2:15; Romans 3:20; Romans 3:27; Romans 3:28; Romans 4:2; Romans 4:6; Romans 9:11; Romans 9:32; Romans 11:6; Romans 13:3; Romans 15:18; I Corinthians 3:13; I Corinthians 3:14; I Corinthians 3:15; I Corinthians 5:2; I Corinthians 9:1; I Corinthians 15:58; I Corinthians 16:10; II Corinthians 9:8; II Corinthians 10:11; Galatians 2:16; Galatians 3:2; Galatians 3:5; Galatians 3:10; Galatians 5:19; Galatians 6:4; Ephesians 2:9; Ephesians 2:10; Ephesians 4:12; Philippians 1:22; Philippians 2:30; Colossians 1:10; Colossians 1:21; Colossians 3:17; I Thess 1:3; I Thess 5:13; II Thess 1:11; II Thess 2:17; I Timothy 2:10; I Timothy 3:1; I Timothy 5:10; I Timothy 5:25; I Timothy 6:18; II Timothy 1:9; II Timothy 2:21; II Timothy 3:17; II Timothy 4:5; II Timothy 4:14; II Timothy 4:18; Titus 1:16; Titus 2:7; Titus 3:1; Titus 3:5; Titus 3:8; Titus 3:14; Hebrews 4:10; Hebrews 6:1; Hebrews 6:10; Hebrews 9:14; Hebrews 10:24; Hebrews 13:21; James 1:4; James 1:25; James 2:14; James 2:17; James 2:18; James 2:20; James 2:21; James 2:22; James 2:24; James 2:25; James 2:26; James 3:13; I Peter 1:17; I Peter 2:12; II Peter 2:8; I John 3:12; I John 3:18; II John 1:11; III John 1:10; Jude 1:15; Revelation 2:2; Revelation 2:5; Revelation 2:6; Revelation 2:9; Revelation 2:13; Revelation 2:22; Revelation 2:23; Revelation 2:26; Revelation 2:19; Revelation 3:1; Revelation 3:2; Revelation 3:8; Revelation 3:15; Revelation 9:20; Revelation 14:13; Revelation 16:11; Revelation 18:6; Revelation 20:12; Revelation 20:13; Revelation 22:12.

Example
1 Corinthians 3:13-15
each one's érgon (work) shall be revealed. For the Day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try each one's érgon (work) as to what kind it is.
If anyone's érgon (work) which he built remains, he shall receive a reward.
If anyone's érgon (work) shall be burned up, he shall suffer loss. But he shall be saved, yet so as by fire.

2. stoicheîon (Strongs Greek 04747)

The word stoicheîon refers to the rudiments of this world in Galatians 4:3; Galatians 4:9; Colossians 2:8; Colossians 2:20; Hebrews 5:12.

Example
Colossians 2:8:
Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments [stoicheîon] of the world, and not after Christ.

3. parérchomai

In every verse it's found, the word parérchomai is used interchangeably for "passing by" or "passing closeby" (Matthew 8:28; Mark 6:48; Luke 18:37; Acts 16:8), or for "coming near/approaching near" or "seizing upon" (Luke 12:37; Acts 24:7), or to pass, or to pass from, or to have passed (Mat.14:15 & 26:39; Luk.11:42 & 15:29; Acts 27:9; 2 Cor.5:17; Jam.1:10; 1 Pet.4:3; Mat.24:34-35).

Example
Acts 24:7:
"But the chief captain Lysias came upon [parérchomai] us, and with great violence took him away out of our hands."

Here is a short statement that contains all three of the above words:

2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away [parérchomai] with a great noise, and the elements [stoicheîon] shall be dissolved [lýō] with fervent heat [kausóō], the earth also and the works [érgon] that are therein shall be burned up [katakaíō].

Should the actual meaning of the words érgon, stoicheîon, and parérchomai in every other New Testament verse they are used affect the way we interpret what Peter said, or not? Because if we use the meaning as all the other verses do, then Peter is saying that the works of men and of darkness and the principles of this world will be burned up when Christ returns.

The whole context of what Peter was saying in the chapters and verses before about false teachers etc, and the fact that he says we will see a new heavens and earth in which only righteousness dwells, should tell us that Peter is not speaking about the burning up of the planet, but of the works of men and the principles of this world.

 

[Randy Kluth]

Take a look at the following three Greek words:

1. érgon (Strongs Greek 02041)

Throughout the New Testament and without exception, érgon (works) always refers to the words of God / Christ, or of men, or of Satan (the vast majority of times it refers to the works of men):-

Works of Christ and of God the Father:-

Matthew 11:2; Luke 24:19; John 4:34; John 5:20; John 5:36; John 6:28; John 6:29; John 7:3; John 7:21; John 9:3; John 9:4; John 10:25; John 10:32; John 10:33; John 10:37; John 10:38; John 14:10; John 14:11; John 14:12; John 15:24; John 17:4; Acts 13:41; Acts 15:18; Romans 14:20; Philippians 1:6; Hebrews 1:10; Hebrews 2:7; Hebrews 3:9; Hebrews 4:3; Hebrews 4:4; Revelation 15:3.

Works of darkness or of Satan:-

Romans 13:12; II Corinthians 11:15; Ephesians 5:11; I John 3:8.

Works of men:-

Matthew 5:16; Matthew 23:3; Matthew 23:5; Matthew 26:10; Mark 13:34; Mark 14:6; Luke 11:48; John 3:19; John 3:20; John 3:21; John 7:7; John 8:39; John 8:41; Acts 5:38; Acts 7:22; Acts 7:41; Acts 9:36; Acts 13:2; Acts 14:26; Acts 15:38; Acts 26:20; Titus 2:14; Romans 2:6; Romans 2:7; Romans 2:15; Romans 3:20; Romans 3:27; Romans 3:28; Romans 4:2; Romans 4:6; Romans 9:11; Romans 9:32; Romans 11:6; Romans 13:3; Romans 15:18; I Corinthians 3:13; I Corinthians 3:14; I Corinthians 3:15; I Corinthians 5:2; I Corinthians 9:1; I Corinthians 15:58; I Corinthians 16:10; II Corinthians 9:8; II Corinthians 10:11; Galatians 2:16; Galatians 3:2; Galatians 3:5; Galatians 3:10; Galatians 5:19; Galatians 6:4; Ephesians 2:9; Ephesians 2:10; Ephesians 4:12; Philippians 1:22; Philippians 2:30; Colossians 1:10; Colossians 1:21; Colossians 3:17; I Thess 1:3; I Thess 5:13; II Thess 1:11; II Thess 2:17; I Timothy 2:10; I Timothy 3:1; I Timothy 5:10; I Timothy 5:25; I Timothy 6:18; II Timothy 1:9; II Timothy 2:21; II Timothy 3:17; II Timothy 4:5; II Timothy 4:14; II Timothy 4:18; Titus 1:16; Titus 2:7; Titus 3:1; Titus 3:5; Titus 3:8; Titus 3:14; Hebrews 4:10; Hebrews 6:1; Hebrews 6:10; Hebrews 9:14; Hebrews 10:24; Hebrews 13:21; James 1:4; James 1:25; James 2:14; James 2:17; James 2:18; James 2:20; James 2:21; James 2:22; James 2:24; James 2:25; James 2:26; James 3:13; I Peter 1:17; I Peter 2:12; II Peter 2:8; I John 3:12; I John 3:18; II John 1:11; III John 1:10; Jude 1:15; Revelation 2:2; Revelation 2:5; Revelation 2:6; Revelation 2:9; Revelation 2:13; Revelation 2:22; Revelation 2:23; Revelation 2:26; Revelation 2:19; Revelation 3:1; Revelation 3:2; Revelation 3:8; Revelation 3:15; Revelation 9:20; Revelation 14:13; Revelation 16:11; Revelation 18:6; Revelation 20:12; Revelation 20:13; Revelation 22:12.

Example
1 Corinthians 3:13-15
each one's érgon (work) shall be revealed. For the Day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try each one's érgon (work) as to what kind it is.
If anyone's érgon (work) which he built remains, he shall receive a reward.
If anyone's érgon (work) shall be burned up, he shall suffer loss. But he shall be saved, yet so as by fire.

2. stoicheîon (Strongs Greek 04747)

The word stoicheîon refers to the rudiments of this world in Galatians 4:3; Galatians 4:9; Colossians 2:8; Colossians 2:20; Hebrews 5:12.

Example
Colossians 2:8:
Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments [stoicheîon] of the world, and not after Christ.

3. parérchomai

In every verse it's found, the word parérchomai is used interchangeably for "passing by" or "passing closeby" (Matthew 8:28; Mark 6:48; Luke 18:37; Acts 16:8), or for "coming near/approaching near" or "seizing upon" (Luke 12:37; Acts 24:7), or to pass, or to pass from, or to have passed (Mat.14:15 & 26:39; Luk.11:42 & 15:29; Acts 27:9; 2 Cor.5:17; Jam.1:10; 1 Pet.4:3; Mat.24:34-35).

Example
Acts 24:7:
"But the chief captain Lysias came upon [parérchomai] us, and with great violence took him away out of our hands."

Here is a short statement that contains all three of the above words:

2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away [parérchomai] with a great noise, and the elements [stoicheîon] shall be dissolved [lýō] with fervent heat [kausóō], the earth also and the works [érgon] that are therein shall be burned up [katakaíō].

Should the actual meaning of the words érgon, stoicheîon, and parérchomai in every other New Testament verse they are used affect the way we interpret what Peter said, or not? Because if we use the meaning as all the other verses do, then Peter is saying that the works of men and of darkness and the principles of this world will be burned up when Christ returns.

The whole context of what Peter was saying in the chapters and verses before about false teachers etc, and the fact that he says we will see a new heavens and earth in which only righteousness dwells, should tell us that Peter is not speaking about the burning up of the planet, but of the works of men and the principles of this world.

I always find it safe to determine the context for the various words that are used. Words are flexible and can have different meanings, depending on the context.

So I would interpret the verse as follows, according to context.... Heaven and earth will experience dissolution. We may envision a major fire causing what was once a city to utterly disappear. In this case, the fire is not just on the earth, but reaching up towards the sky. Think: nuclear bombs.

I say this because the ancient text was not envisioning modern weapons, but rather, the then-current standard for major judgment, namely the complete removal of kingdoms by the destruction of their entire civilization by fire. To have both heaven and earth destroyed by fire would not have been viewed as ending the universe, which God created to last forever. Rather, it would have to do with something like the flood, a major upheaval in a corrupt system to make way for a new order. Just my opinion....

 

[Zao is life]

To have both heaven and earth destroyed by fire would not have been viewed as ending the universe, which God created to last forever. Rather, it would have to do with something like the flood, a major upheaval in a corrupt system to make way for a new order. Just my opinion....

Yes I agree with that statement, because the earth being destroyed by fire is the language used in prophecies regarding what was then (when it was written) prophecy about the coming judgment of Babylon:

Destruction of ancient Babylon ("the nations" of the Babylonian Empire)

Isaiah 34:4
And all the host of the heavens shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled like a scroll; and all their host shall droop, as a leaf falls off from the vine, and as the falling from the fig tree.

Isaiah 34:8-10
For it is the day of the LORD's vengeance, the year to repay for the fighting against Zion. And its streams shall be turned into pitch, and its dust to brimstone, and its land shall become burning pitch. It shall not be put out night or day; its smoke shall go up forever. From generation to generation it shall lie waste; none passes through it forever and forever.

Isaiah 13:13
So I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall move out of its place, in the wrath of the LORD of hosts, and in the day of His fierce anger.

Isaiah 13:8-10
.. they shall be afraid. Pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them. They shall be in pain like a woman who travails. They shall be amazed at one another, their faces like flames.
Behold, the day of the LORD comes, cruel and with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land waste; and He shall destroy its sinners out of it.
For the stars of the heavens and their constellations shall not give light; the sun shall be darkened in its going forth, and the moon shall not reflect its light.

The above did not happen in a literal sense when Babylon was judged. Fire just happens to be a metaphor for God's actions. Tongues of fire on the Day of Pentecost, but it wasn't a judgment. The fire spoken of by Peter and here is the fire of judgment:

"in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God and who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ, who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power." (2 Thess.1:8-9).

The Palmist also says that God did the following to Egypt:

Psalm 105
25 He turned their heart to hate His people, to deal craftily with His servants.
26 He sent Moses His servant, and Aaron whom He had chosen.
27 They showed His signs among them, and wonders in the land of Ham.
28 He sent darkness, and made it dark; and they did not rebel against His word.
29 He turned their waters into blood, and killed their fish.
30 Their land swarmed with frogs in the rooms of their kings.
31 He spoke, and there came fly swarms and gnats in all their borders.
32 He gave them hail for rain and flaming fire in their land.
33 He struck their vines also and their fig trees, and broke the trees of their borders.
34 He spoke, and locusts came, and larvae without number;
35 and they ate up all the plants in their land, and ate the fruit of their ground.

Same sort of judgment plagues written about in the Revelation, but also different (the locusts in the Revelation harm no green thing for example).

The old order will definitely be brought to an end and I do believe that we will see a rejuvenated heavens and earth, but the dissolution is not the way many interpret this passage, IMO.

 

[bluedragon]

How can Greek be translated, when English can't fully explain Greek? Greek has one word for hand. No word for wrist. Therefore the nails were driven in the hands of Jesus ......Yet the archeological evidence says otherwise. Tombs opened had crucified victims whose bones were fossilized or still evident where the nail had struck a knot in the wood, bent, and the nail and bones to the wrist were in place .....No nail through the palms of the hands.

 

[WPM]

Yes I agree with that statement, because the earth being destroyed by fire is the language used in prophecies regarding what was then (when it was written) prophecy about the coming judgment of Babylon:

Destruction of ancient Babylon ("the nations" of the Babylonian Empire)

Isaiah 34:4
And all the host of the heavens shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled like a scroll; and all their host shall droop, as a leaf falls off from the vine, and as the falling from the fig tree.

Isaiah 34:8-10
For it is the day of the LORD's vengeance, the year to repay for the fighting against Zion. And its streams shall be turned into pitch, and its dust to brimstone, and its land shall become burning pitch. It shall not be put out night or day; its smoke shall go up forever. From generation to generation it shall lie waste; none passes through it forever and forever.

Isaiah 13:13
So I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall move out of its place, in the wrath of the LORD of hosts, and in the day of His fierce anger.

Isaiah 13:8-10
.. they shall be afraid. Pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them. They shall be in pain like a woman who travails. They shall be amazed at one another, their faces like flames.
Behold, the day of the LORD comes, cruel and with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land waste; and He shall destroy its sinners out of it.
For the stars of the heavens and their constellations shall not give light; the sun shall be darkened in its going forth, and the moon shall not reflect its light.

The above did not happen in a literal sense when Babylon was judged. Fire just happens to be a metaphor for God's actions. Tongues of fire on the Day of Pentecost, but it wasn't a judgment. The fire spoken of by Peter and here is the fire of judgment:

"in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God and who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ, who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power." (2 Thess.1:8-9).

The Palmist also says that God did the following to Egypt:

Psalm 105
25 He turned their heart to hate His people, to deal craftily with His servants.
26 He sent Moses His servant, and Aaron whom He had chosen.
27 They showed His signs among them, and wonders in the land of Ham.
28 He sent darkness, and made it dark; and they did not rebel against His word.
29 He turned their waters into blood, and killed their fish.
30 Their land swarmed with frogs in the rooms of their kings.
31 He spoke, and there came fly swarms and gnats in all their borders.
32 He gave them hail for rain and flaming fire in their land.
33 He struck their vines also and their fig trees, and broke the trees of their borders.
34 He spoke, and locusts came, and larvae without number;
35 and they ate up all the plants in their land, and ate the fruit of their ground.

Same sort of judgment plagues written about in the Revelation, but also different (thelocusts in the Revelation kill no green thing for example).

The old order will definitely be brought to an end and I do believe that we will see a rejuvenated heavens and earth, but the dissolution is not the way many interpret this passage, IMO.

Premils are becoming more like Full Preterists by the day in order to somehow justify Premil in the light of numerous climactic Scriptures.

This is a testimony to the strength of the Amil argument on forums like this.

It is fun to watch.

Your fight is with the sacred text.

 

[Zao is life]

Premils are becoming more like Full Preterists in order to somehow justify Premil in the light of numerous climactic Scriptures.

It is fun to watch.

Your fight is with the sacred text.

Your fight is against anyone who disagrees with your own personal interpretation of the sacred text,

and as usual your first post begins with a false accusation about me fighting against scripture, just because it doesn't agree with your interpretations, while you make it clear that you hold your own beliefs and personal interpretations more sacred than scripture itself.

 

[WPM]

Your fight is against anyone who disagrees with your own personal interpretation of the sacred text,

and as usual your first post begins with a false accusation about me fighting against scripture, just because it doesn't agree with your interpretations which you make it clear that you hold more sacred than the scripture itself.

Not so! Like Full Preterists, Premils are having to move away from a literal reading of Scripture in order for their theology to fit.

It is, in fact, classic Amils that are now carrying the literalist banner.

 

[Zao is life]

Like Full Preterists, Premils are having to move away from a literal reading of Scripture in order for their theology to fit.

It is, in fact, classic Amils that are now carrying the literalist banner.

Except when it comes to the millennium, of course. Plus a whole lot of other things in the Revelation.

@WPM proving once again that you pick and choose at your own personal whims and fancies about when to "carry the literalist banner" and when not to in your own personal interpretations of scripture which you hold more sacred than the scripture itself.

 

[WPM]

Except when it comes to the millennium, of course. Plus a whole lot of other things in the Revelation.

@WPM proving once again that you pick and choose at your own personal whims and fancies about when to "carry the literalist banner" and when not to in your own personal interpretations of scripture which you hold more sacred than the scripture itself.

Not at all! Quite the opposite! In fact, the objective Bible student (before he is indoctrinated by man) quickly realizes that Revelation is saturated in figurative language. The fact you fight that is testimony to how selective you are in your studies. The foremost consideration when studying Scripture must be to establish the grammatical contextual meaning of the text, whether it is literal, figurative or parabolic, and who, what and when it relates to. Is it speaking of the past, present or future? Is it principally speaking to the people receiving it or is it speaking prophetically of an approaching event? We should always be sensitive to its setting, style of writing, and the respective subject under discussion.

 

[WPM]

Take a look at the following three Greek words:

1. érgon (Strongs Greek 02041)

Throughout the New Testament and without exception, érgon (works) always refers to the works of God / Christ, or of men, or of Satan (the vast majority of times it refers to the works of men):-

Works of Christ and of God the Father:-

Matthew 11:2; Luke 24:19; John 4:34; John 5:20; John 5:36; John 6:28; John 6:29; John 7:3; John 7:21; John 9:3; John 9:4; John 10:25; John 10:32; John 10:33; John 10:37; John 10:38; John 14:10; John 14:11; John 14:12; John 15:24; John 17:4; Acts 13:41; Acts 15:18; Romans 14:20; Philippians 1:6; Hebrews 1:10; Hebrews 2:7; Hebrews 3:9; Hebrews 4:3; Hebrews 4:4; Revelation 15:3.

Works of darkness or of Satan:-

Romans 13:12; II Corinthians 11:15; Ephesians 5:11; I John 3:8.

Works of men:-

Matthew 5:16; Matthew 23:3; Matthew 23:5; Matthew 26:10; Mark 13:34; Mark 14:6; Luke 11:48; John 3:19; John 3:20; John 3:21; John 7:7; John 8:39; John 8:41; Acts 5:38; Acts 7:22; Acts 7:41; Acts 9:36; Acts 13:2; Acts 14:26; Acts 15:38; Acts 26:20; Titus 2:14; Romans 2:6; Romans 2:7; Romans 2:15; Romans 3:20; Romans 3:27; Romans 3:28; Romans 4:2; Romans 4:6; Romans 9:11; Romans 9:32; Romans 11:6; Romans 13:3; Romans 15:18; I Corinthians 3:13; I Corinthians 3:14; I Corinthians 3:15; I Corinthians 5:2; I Corinthians 9:1; I Corinthians 15:58; I Corinthians 16:10; II Corinthians 9:8; II Corinthians 10:11; Galatians 2:16; Galatians 3:2; Galatians 3:5; Galatians 3:10; Galatians 5:19; Galatians 6:4; Ephesians 2:9; Ephesians 2:10; Ephesians 4:12; Philippians 1:22; Philippians 2:30; Colossians 1:10; Colossians 1:21; Colossians 3:17; I Thess 1:3; I Thess 5:13; II Thess 1:11; II Thess 2:17; I Timothy 2:10; I Timothy 3:1; I Timothy 5:10; I Timothy 5:25; I Timothy 6:18; II Timothy 1:9; II Timothy 2:21; II Timothy 3:17; II Timothy 4:5; II Timothy 4:14; II Timothy 4:18; Titus 1:16; Titus 2:7; Titus 3:1; Titus 3:5; Titus 3:8; Titus 3:14; Hebrews 4:10; Hebrews 6:1; Hebrews 6:10; Hebrews 9:14; Hebrews 10:24; Hebrews 13:21; James 1:4; James 1:25; James 2:14; James 2:17; James 2:18; James 2:20; James 2:21; James 2:22; James 2:24; James 2:25; James 2:26; James 3:13; I Peter 1:17; I Peter 2:12; II Peter 2:8; I John 3:12; I John 3:18; II John 1:11; III John 1:10; Jude 1:15; Revelation 2:2; Revelation 2:5; Revelation 2:6; Revelation 2:9; Revelation 2:13; Revelation 2:22; Revelation 2:23; Revelation 2:26; Revelation 2:19; Revelation 3:1; Revelation 3:2; Revelation 3:8; Revelation 3:15; Revelation 9:20; Revelation 14:13; Revelation 16:11; Revelation 18:6; Revelation 20:12; Revelation 20:13; Revelation 22:12.

Example
1 Corinthians 3:13-15
each one's érgon (work) shall be revealed. For the Day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try each one's érgon (work) as to what kind it is.
If anyone's érgon (work) which he built remains, he shall receive a reward.
If anyone's érgon (work) shall be burned up, he shall suffer loss. But he shall be saved, yet so as by fire.

2. stoicheîon (Strongs Greek 04747)

The word stoicheîon refers to the rudiments of this world in Galatians 4:3; Galatians 4:9; Colossians 2:8; Colossians 2:20; Hebrews 5:12.

Example
Colossians 2:8:
Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments [stoicheîon] of the world, and not after Christ.

3. parérchomai

In every verse it's found, the word parérchomai is used interchangeably for "passing by" or "passing closeby" (Matthew 8:28; Mark 6:48; Luke 18:37; Acts 16:8), or for "coming near/approaching near" or "seizing upon" (Luke 12:37; Acts 24:7), or to pass, or to pass from, or to have passed (Mat.14:15 & 26:39; Luk.11:42 & 15:29; Acts 27:9; 2 Cor.5:17; Jam.1:10; 1 Pet.4:3; Mat.24:34-35).

Example
Acts 24:7:
"But the chief captain Lysias came upon [parérchomai] us, and with great violence took him away out of our hands."

Here is a short statement that contains all three of the above words:

2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away [parérchomai] with a great noise, and the elements [stoicheîon] shall be dissolved [lýō] with fervent heat [kausóō], the earth also and the works [érgon] that are therein shall be burned up [katakaíō].

Should the actual meaning of the words érgon, stoicheîon, and parérchomai in every other New Testament verse they are used affect the way we interpret what Peter said, or not? Because if we use the meaning as all the other verses do, then Peter is saying that the works of men and of darkness and the principles of this world will be burned up when Christ returns.

The whole context of what Peter was saying in the chapters and verses before about false teachers etc, and the fact that he says we will see a new heavens and earth in which only righteousness dwells, should tell us that Peter is not speaking about the burning up of the planet, but of the works of men and the principles of this world.

Time after time, as the Premillennialist theology is closely examined by the Word of God, it is shown to be wanting. Whilst they boast of a literal attitude to the interpretation of Scripture, passage after passage that is clear and literal in its meaning is explained away in order to sustain their opinion of Premillenniliasm.

A careful study of the Greek words ouranos and gē mentioned in 2 Peter 3, which some Premillennialists are forced to redefine, shows your interpretation to be in error. 59 times in the New Testament “heaven” and “earth” are coupled together in the same passage describing exactly what the outside of the box says – what most ordinary people would understand as “heaven” and “earth.” Interestingly, in every case, the two Greek words ouranos and gē are employed to describe the heavenly realm and the globe of the earth. Philippians 2:10 is the only slight variation, although it is only a technical difference, where a literal reading of the text should read ‘earthly’ (epigeios) and ‘heavenly’ (epouranios). However, both significantly were derived from the same two repeated Greek words used elsewhere to describe “heaven” and “earth” – ouranos and gē. What is more, of the 6 references to “heavens” (plural) and “earth” all use these two same Greek words.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Take a look at the following three Greek words:

1. érgon (Strongs Greek 02041)

Throughout the New Testament and without exception, érgon (works) always refers to the works of God / Christ, or of men, or of Satan (the vast majority of times it refers to the works of men):-

Works of Christ and of God the Father:-

Matthew 11:2; Luke 24:19; John 4:34; John 5:20; John 5:36; John 6:28; John 6:29; John 7:3; John 7:21; John 9:3; John 9:4; John 10:25; John 10:32; John 10:33; John 10:37; John 10:38; John 14:10; John 14:11; John 14:12; John 15:24; John 17:4; Acts 13:41; Acts 15:18; Romans 14:20; Philippians 1:6; Hebrews 1:10; Hebrews 2:7; Hebrews 3:9; Hebrews 4:3; Hebrews 4:4; Revelation 15:3.

Works of darkness or of Satan:-

Romans 13:12; II Corinthians 11:15; Ephesians 5:11; I John 3:8.

Works of men:-

Matthew 5:16; Matthew 23:3; Matthew 23:5; Matthew 26:10; Mark 13:34; Mark 14:6; Luke 11:48; John 3:19; John 3:20; John 3:21; John 7:7; John 8:39; John 8:41; Acts 5:38; Acts 7:22; Acts 7:41; Acts 9:36; Acts 13:2; Acts 14:26; Acts 15:38; Acts 26:20; Titus 2:14; Romans 2:6; Romans 2:7; Romans 2:15; Romans 3:20; Romans 3:27; Romans 3:28; Romans 4:2; Romans 4:6; Romans 9:11; Romans 9:32; Romans 11:6; Romans 13:3; Romans 15:18; I Corinthians 3:13; I Corinthians 3:14; I Corinthians 3:15; I Corinthians 5:2; I Corinthians 9:1; I Corinthians 15:58; I Corinthians 16:10; II Corinthians 9:8; II Corinthians 10:11; Galatians 2:16; Galatians 3:2; Galatians 3:5; Galatians 3:10; Galatians 5:19; Galatians 6:4; Ephesians 2:9; Ephesians 2:10; Ephesians 4:12; Philippians 1:22; Philippians 2:30; Colossians 1:10; Colossians 1:21; Colossians 3:17; I Thess 1:3; I Thess 5:13; II Thess 1:11; II Thess 2:17; I Timothy 2:10; I Timothy 3:1; I Timothy 5:10; I Timothy 5:25; I Timothy 6:18; II Timothy 1:9; II Timothy 2:21; II Timothy 3:17; II Timothy 4:5; II Timothy 4:14; II Timothy 4:18; Titus 1:16; Titus 2:7; Titus 3:1; Titus 3:5; Titus 3:8; Titus 3:14; Hebrews 4:10; Hebrews 6:1; Hebrews 6:10; Hebrews 9:14; Hebrews 10:24; Hebrews 13:21; James 1:4; James 1:25; James 2:14; James 2:17; James 2:18; James 2:20; James 2:21; James 2:22; James 2:24; James 2:25; James 2:26; James 3:13; I Peter 1:17; I Peter 2:12; II Peter 2:8; I John 3:12; I John 3:18; II John 1:11; III John 1:10; Jude 1:15; Revelation 2:2; Revelation 2:5; Revelation 2:6; Revelation 2:9; Revelation 2:13; Revelation 2:22; Revelation 2:23; Revelation 2:26; Revelation 2:19; Revelation 3:1; Revelation 3:2; Revelation 3:8; Revelation 3:15; Revelation 9:20; Revelation 14:13; Revelation 16:11; Revelation 18:6; Revelation 20:12; Revelation 20:13; Revelation 22:12.

Example
1 Corinthians 3:13-15
each one's érgon (work) shall be revealed. For the Day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try each one's érgon (work) as to what kind it is.
If anyone's érgon (work) which he built remains, he shall receive a reward.
If anyone's érgon (work) shall be burned up, he shall suffer loss. But he shall be saved, yet so as by fire.

2. stoicheîon (Strongs Greek 04747)

The word stoicheîon refers to the rudiments of this world in Galatians 4:3; Galatians 4:9; Colossians 2:8; Colossians 2:20; Hebrews 5:12.

Example
Colossians 2:8:
Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments [stoicheîon] of the world, and not after Christ.

3. parérchomai

In every verse it's found, the word parérchomai is used interchangeably for "passing by" or "passing closeby" (Matthew 8:28; Mark 6:48; Luke 18:37; Acts 16:8), or for "coming near/approaching near" or "seizing upon" (Luke 12:37; Acts 24:7), or to pass, or to pass from, or to have passed (Mat.14:15 & 26:39; Luk.11:42 & 15:29; Acts 27:9; 2 Cor.5:17; Jam.1:10; 1 Pet.4:3; Mat.24:34-35).

Example
Acts 24:7:
"But the chief captain Lysias came upon [parérchomai] us, and with great violence took him away out of our hands."

Here is a short statement that contains all three of the above words:

2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away [parérchomai] with a great noise, and the elements [stoicheîon] shall be dissolved [lýō] with fervent heat [kausóō], the earth also and the works [érgon] that are therein shall be burned up [katakaíō].

Should the actual meaning of the words érgon, stoicheîon, and parérchomai in every other New Testament verse they are used affect the way we interpret what Peter said, or not? Because if we use the meaning as all the other verses do, then Peter is saying that the works of men and of darkness and the principles of this world will be burned up when Christ returns.

The whole context of what Peter was saying in the chapters and verses before about false teachers etc, and the fact that he says we will see a new heavens and earth in which only righteousness dwells, should tell us that Peter is not speaking about the burning up of the planet, but of the works of men and the principles of this world.

What exactly are you getting at here then? How exactly do you interpret 2 Peter 3:10-12? What does it mean for "the works of men and the principles of this world" to be burned up? What is the result of that in your view?

I believe we should interpret 2 Peter 3:10-12 in light of what Peter had said just a little bit earlier.

2 Peter 3:3 Above all, you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come, scoffing and following their own evil desires. 4 They will say, “Where is this ‘coming’ he promised? Ever since our ancestors died, everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation.” 5 But they deliberately forget that long ago by God’s word the heavens came into being and the earth was formed out of water and by water. 6 By these waters also the world of that time was deluged and destroyed. 7 By the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire, being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly.

So, what Peter was saying here was in relation to the promise of the second coming of Christ. Agree? He said that in the last days there would be scoffers scoffing at the promise of Christ's second coming. Then he indicated that these scoffers were ignorant about what happened in the past when God created the heavens and He created the earth "out of water and by water" and He flooded and destroyed the entire earth with those waters. Then he said "by the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire". So, what he was saying there is just as God destroyed the earth with water in the past, He will destroy the earth in the future, only this time with fire.

So, with that in mind, why would we think that 2 Peter 3:10-12 is talking about anything except for the literal burning up and destruction of everything on the earth just like how the flood waters destroyed everyone on the earth long ago? Yes, understanding the definitions of the Greek words our English Bibles were translated from is important, but understanding the context of what was written is even more important.

 

[Zao is life]

The foremost consideration when studying Scripture must be to establish the grammatical contextual meaning of the text, whether it is literal, figurative or parabolic,

Which is why the fact that Peter is talking about false teachers and false doctrines before he says what he does about the rudiments of the world and the works of men being burned up when Christ returns, and afterward again, when he closes his statement, should be taken into consideration, but you do not do so, proving once again that you pick and choose when to believe your own statements.

 

[Zao is life]

Time after time, as the Premillennialist theology is closely examined by the Word of God, it is shown to be wanting. Whilst they boast of a literal attitude to the interpretation of Scripture, passage after passage that is clear and literal in its meaning is explained away in order to sustain their opinion of Premillenniliasm.

A careful study of the Greek words ouranos and gē mentioned in 2 Peter 3, which some Premillennialists are forced to redefine, shows your interpretation to be in error. 59 times in the New Testament “heaven” and “earth” are coupled together in the same passage describing exactly what the outside of the box says – what most ordinary people would understand as “heaven” and “earth.” Interestingly, in every case, the two Greek words ouranos and gē are employed to describe the heavenly realm and the globe of the earth. Philippians 2:10 is the only slight variation, although it is only a technical difference, where a literal reading of the text should read ‘earthly’ (epigeios) and ‘heavenly’ (epouranios). However, both significantly were derived from the same two repeated Greek words used elsewhere to describe “heaven” and “earth” – ouranos and gē. What is more, of the 6 references to “heavens” (plural) and “earth” all use these two same Greek words.

.. and the fact of the meaning of heaven and earth proves your thesis how? You absolutely fail in your attempt at exegesis, and fail dismally, because you fail to note the context in which Peter mentions the new heavens and new earth, that being that he had been speaking about false teaching and false teachers and the rudiments of this world, and had just said that the rudiments of this world and the works of men would be burned up but would be replaced with righteousness.

Paul said in Christ we are already a new creature and old things have already passed away. So has 2 Peter 3 already taken place too then? If the one is already the status quo, then the other is too then, no?

No, the problem with your interpretations is that you have literalized what is not literal, and you turn what is literal into something that is figurative - then you turn around and claim others are doing what you yourself are doing.

Doesn't work. Not in scripture, Only in the way you view scripture.

 

[Zao is life]

What exactly are you getting at here then? How exactly do you interpret 2 Peter 3:10-12? What does it mean for "the works of men and the principles of this world" to be burned up? What is the result of that in your view?

I believe we should interpret 2 Peter 3:10-12 in light of what Peter had said just a little bit earlier.

2 Peter 3:3 Above all, you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come, scoffing and following their own evil desires. 4 They will say, “Where is this ‘coming’ he promised? Ever since our ancestors died, everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation.” 5 But they deliberately forget that long ago by God’s word the heavens came into being and the earth was formed out of water and by water. 6 By these waters also the world of that time was deluged and destroyed. 7 By the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire, being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly.

So, what Peter was saying here was in relation to the promise of the second coming of Christ. Agree? He said that in the last days there would be scoffers scoffing at the promise of Christ's second coming. Then he indicated that these scoffers were ignorant about what happened in the past when God created the heavens and He created the earth "out of water and by water" and He flooded and destroyed the entire earth with those waters. Then he said "by the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire". So, what he was saying there is just as God destroyed the earth with water in the past, He will destroy the earth in the future, only this time with fire.

So, with that in mind, why would we think that 2 Peter 3:10-12 is talking about anything except for the literal burning up and destruction of everything on the earth just like how the flood waters destroyed everyone on the earth long ago? Yes, understanding the definitions of the Greek words our English Bibles were translated from is important, but understanding the context of what was written is even more important.

What exactly are you saying here?

Tell us, what else was Peter talking about before scripture was divided into separate chapters by scribes?

He was talking about the rudiments of this world and the works of men. So he says that both will be burned up on the Day of the LORD and replaced with righteousness in the new heavens and new earth, which Paul teaches is already here for those who are in Christ, because we are a new creature, and all old things have already passed away and all things have already become new.

The way God burns the rudiments of this world and the works of men up is through the fire of judgment. The whole Bible is proof of that.

Paul teaches that the entire creation will become liberated from the bondage of decay when the sons of God are revealed in the resurrection. Peter did not contradict him by saying that the earth will be completely destroyed and replaced with a new creation. It's not a new creation of the heavens and the earth, but a new heavens and earth. Something that appears out of what is decaying.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

What exactly are you saying here?

I asked you first. If you answer my question and address what I said in my post then I'll answer your question and address what you said in your reply. That's how discussions work.

 

[WPM]

.. and the fact of the meaning of heaven and earth proves your thesis how? You absolutely fail in your attempt at exegesis, and fail dismally, because you fail to note the context in which Peter mentions the new heavens and new earth, that being that he had been speaking about false teaching and false teachers and the rudiments of this world, and had just said that the rudiments of this world and the works of men would be burned up but would be replaced with righteousness.

Paul said in Christ we are already a new creature and old things have already passed away. So has 2 Peter 3 already taken place too then? If the one is already the status quo, then the other is too then, no?

No, the problem with your interpretations is that you have literalized what is not literal, and you turn what is literal into something that is figurative - then you turn around and claim others are doing what you yourself are doing.

Doesn't work. Not in scripture, Only in the way you view scripture.

These are all Full Preterist arguments and they butcher the literal wording and context of plain straightforward Scripture. I will take this a confession that you have no answer for Amil.

 

[WPM]

2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away [parérchomai] with a great noise, and the elements [stoicheîon] shall be dissolved [lýō] with fervent heat [kausóō], the earth also and the works [érgon] that are therein shall be burned up [katakaíō].

Should the actual meaning of the words érgon, stoicheîon, and parérchomai in every other New Testament verse they are used affect the way we interpret what Peter said, or not? Because if we use the meaning as all the other verses do, then Peter is saying that the works of men and of darkness and the principles of this world will be burned up when Christ returns.

The whole context of what Peter was saying in the chapters and verses before about false teachers etc, and the fact that he says we will see a new heavens and earth in which only righteousness dwells, should tell us that Peter is not speaking about the burning up of the planet, but of the works of men and the principles of this world.

The “elements” in view in 2 Peter 3 that “melt with fervent heat” when Jesus comes as “a thief in the night” obviously relate to creation. That is the context that Peter is talking about. He’s talking about the removal of the entire fallen visible physical system. The word denotes the “rudiments” of anything; the minute parts or portions of which anything is composed, or which constitutes the simple portions out of which anything grows, or of which it is compounded. Here it would properly denote the component parts of the material world; or those which enter into its composition, and of which it is made up.

Carbon, hydrogen, oxygen, nitrogen and phosphorus are believed to be the chief elements because they are the building blocks that allow life to exist. Those are the most common elements used in biology but there are several others that are also essential, like sodium, chlorine, potassium, iron and magnesium.

• The earth and the works therein are speaking about our habitable globe and everything on it
• The heavens refer to our solar system.
• The elements refer to everything in between.

 

[Zao is life]

I asked you first. If you answer my question and address what I said in my post then I'll answer your question and address what you said in your reply. That's how discussions work.

You have just proved yet again that though someone answers your post, you will claim he didn't the moment you have no answer. Then you wind up having a discussion with yourself.

 

[Zao is life]

These are all Full Preterist arguments and they butcher the literal wording and context of plain straightforward Scripture. I will take this a confession that you have no answer for Amil.

It has nothing to do with Amil. I don't believe that the NHNE that Peter and the Revelation speak about will only follow a thousand years after Christ. That's your view. Except that you believe it will follow thousands of years after Christ. I believe the NHNE comes immediately after Christ. He ushers it in. That's why it's both already here and it's coming - because He is already come and is coming, and His Kingdom is already come and is coming. The new heavens and earth is in Christ and it came into being when He rose from the dead. That's why Paul teaches we are a new creature and in Him all things are become new, but the NHNE is coming. Both already here and still coming.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

You have just proved yet again that though someone answers your post, you will claim he didn't the moment you have no answer. Then you wind up having a discussion with yourself.

Excuse me? You answered my question with a similar question. How are you thinking that you answered my post? You didn't address what I said at all. I am trying to be reasonable here and this is how I get treated in response? Good grief.