Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
I did not say, "make the choice to repent unto God and believe in Jesus Christ, and in the gospel that the apostles preached, every waking day". That's how you are ridiculing my position.
Why do you feel it is so hard to be good?
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Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
I am well aware that you think the choice to believe or not to believe is not a freedom granted to a person but a choice that is forced on a person.
Yes you are, and I didn’t say otherwise. I believe you do. And that’s good. And I thank God for that. Or should I rather thank you? I guess not.
Tong
R4547
Not with your conclusions, in the context of your position of remaining saved. I agree with John’s inspired words, as I said. And that in context of what it means to truly believe or the faith that comes from God.
Tong
R4548
Here’s what I said:
Remember what Paul revealed about the natural (fallen) man concerning the things of the Spirit of God? That the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them,because they are spiritually discerned.
Do you have any questions on that?
Tong
R4549
As I said, our exchanges will bear me out that I am not talking about freedom to believe or not.
Tong
R4550
Please allow me to settle this right now. Ferris is the “ Fool” and you are NOT the Fool.....Anything else need to be settled today before I hit the Golf Course? Lol......just kidding ( kinda) .....
It “ COULD” be that the man “ Living In Sin” is one that rejects the Gospel......it would be a default type of thing, because if you “ Believe” the Gospel , you are Saved.
True Christians , like me, have the Works, but it is an Addition to Salvation....it’s there, but it does not HAVE to be there...let the Holy Spirit hang around long enough and it’s pretty much inevitable....Have you ever “ worked” your mouth to say” Jesus is Lord?” .....great! That’s enough “work “ to get and keep you Saved...that's enough to get you qualified for the Great Promises Of God—- in SPITE of yourself and your yucky behavior.....a Promise like this—- “ You shall NEVER come under Condemnation”
What part of “ never” do you fail to understand ?
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
I understand, perfectly, that you think God assigns to a person whether they will be a believer or whether they will be an unbeliever. There is no freedom of choice in your doctrine. There is only being forced to choose a particular way without any consideration of the desire of the person to choose what they would choose. It's a horrible doctrine.
It's a good point, that if Jesus' commands are to trust Him, and love others, then, well, it seems to make sense to me, if we aren't trusting Him that's living in sin, even not trusting Him to keep His promises to us, including that we will in fact appear with Him, will in fact become like Him, will in fact receive a body like His, will in fact be with Him in that day.
Sorry for the run on sentence! But not enough to edit it.
But still . . . thinking your salvation is your own responsibility, that you must "maintain" your place in Christ, as though you put yourself there, and now you have to keep yourself there, in spite of the Fact that Scripture tells us the true remain there. But not trusting that, as a committed course of action, is that living in sin?
Much love!
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Lol, no, I'm not proving your assertion that ex-believers will never come into condemnation. I'm showing you that John 5:24 says present tense believing people won't come into condemnation. Paul says the same thing in your favorite passage, 1 Corinthians 15:1-4—you are saved if you are presently believing. It's a condition. You have to be presently believing to be saved. You say that's not true. Where in those passages does it say ex-believers who do not presently believe are saved? Show me.
Unbelievers are the ones who find it hard to be good. That's because they don't have the Holy Spirit in salvation. People who can't be good show by their lives that they are not born again:
8The one who practices sin is of the devil...
9Anyone born of God refuses to practice sin...because he has been born of God. 1 John 3:8-9
9Anyone born of God refuses to practice sin...because he has been born of God. 1 John 3:8-9
You say that's not true. You say John is wrong.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Here, I'll make this easy for you to answer.
"...whoever hears My word and believes Him who sent Me has eternal life and will not come under judgment. Indeed, he has crossed over from death to life." John 5:24
John says it is the person who presently believes who has eternal life and will not come under judgment. Where does it say an ex-believer who no longer presently believes has eternal life and will not come under judgment? Show me how John 5:24 proves your point.
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Whatever your arguments, I think it's pretty plain to see no one here is calling the Apostle wrong. These are words you put into another person's mouth, which raises the question, why?
Much love!
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
"...I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received, and in which you stand firm. By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain." 1 Corinthians 15:1-2
'You are saved if you DON'T hold firmly to the word'?
Show me how 1 Corinthians 15:1-2 proves your point.
Ya LOL Mr. idiot is calling Ferris a fool LOL The only reason they let you stay around here is to laugh at you.
Duh....can you dumb it down a little more? Then I will be happy to respond.....
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