You shall Not Murder your children!!

[Illuminator]

 

[Stan B]

Like I said – you’re a cliché – an angry little man who believes charlatans like Alexander Hislop and Loraine Boettner’s heavily debunked works as the basis for your “history”. Whether you know it or not – THEY supplied your “facts”.

Finally – I would LOVE to know what your hatred of Christ’s Church has to do with your complete disregard for life and support of abortion.
So, what’s up with that??

Actually, I've never read Boettner's works, and Hisplop was disjointed and boring. The best of my studies was "Vicars of Christ: The Dark Years of the Papacy" written by best selling author, Peter de Rosa, an ordained Roman Catholic priest, and his subsequent revelation of the conspiracy of Adolf Hitler, a Roman Catholic Church and the Catholic Church to cleanse the world of Jews. For centuries, the Roman Catholic Church has herded God's beloved Jews into ghettos to persecute them, and isolate them from the rest of the world. Adolf Hitler, iconic Roman Catholic, an exemplary example of the fruit of Satan's Roman Catholic religion, both of which are the greatest curse the world has ever known.

I have never said I was in any way pro-abortion. I am not. That's just your Roman Catholic mentality working overtime. Children are a gift from God, and as such, this gift comes with no strings attached, as a gift should be. What I am against, is control-freak religious nutcases, that try to enforce their evil demented nazi-like un-Biblical ideology upon everyone else. That is what the god of Islam demands, and now the pope has formed an alliance with Islam declaring God and the god of Isalm are one and the same God. Enjoy your delusion.

Roman Catholics regard God as some sort of dumbwit, who was too stupid to include a simple commandment: "Thou shalt not have an abortion." God must be so grateful that Romanism came along to rescue Him from His own stupidity!! Or was it Satan?? Duh!!

 

[Stan B]

It's not required under such circumstances, you should know better than to ask such a question, as many specific situations are not necessarily addressed in scripture, even though the broad or general principles are there?

Supporting your hypothesis against abortion is not necessary, because it is not Biblical.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Actually, I've never read Boettner's works, and Hisplop was disjointed and boring. The best of my studies was "Vicars of Christ: The Dark Years of the Papacy" written by best selling author, Peter de Rosa, an ordained Roman Catholic priest, and his subsequent revelation of the conspiracy of Adolf Hitler, a Roman Catholic Church and the Catholic Church to cleanse the world of Jews. For centuries, the Roman Catholic Church has herded God's beloved Jews into ghettos to persecute them, and isolate them from the rest of the world. Adolf Hitler, iconic Roman Catholic, an exemplary example of the fruit of Satan's Roman Catholic religion, both of which are the greatest curse the world has ever known.

I have never said I was in any way pro-abortion. I am not. That's just your Roman Catholic mentality working overtime. Children are a gift from God, and as such, this gift comes with no strings attached, as a gift should be. What I am against, is control-freak religious nutcases, that try to enforce their evil demented nazi-like un-Biblical ideology upon everyone else. That is what the god of Islam demands, and now the pope has formed an alliance with Islam declaring God and the god of Isalm are one and the same God. Enjoy your delusion.

Roman Catholics regard God as some sort of dumbwit, who was too stupid to include a simple commandment: "Thou shalt not have an abortion." God must be so grateful that Romanism came along to rescue Him from His own stupidity!! Or was it Satan?? Duh!!

Peter DeRosa?? That explains a LOT.

You were probably better off reading an anti-Catholic hack like Alexander Hislop. At least there is some comic relief in HIS garbage.

De Rosa, on the other hand, has an obvious ax to grind – and there’s nothing remotely “historical” in his book.

What SHOULD have been a red flag to you was his absolute nonsense about Hitler and Pope Pius XII.
Not only did Pius XII denounce Nazism and Hitler’s reign of terror – he was personally responsible for rescuing THOUSANDS of Jews.

Contrary to what idiots like De Rosa or Rolf Hochhuth, author of the anti Pius XII play, “The Deputy” have to say – Pius Xii was revered by the Jews of Europe and Israel for his efforts during the War. The Chief Rabbi of Rome, Israel Zolli, actually converted to the Catholic Church after the War and took Pius XII’s birth name “Eugenio” as his Baptismal name.

You won’t read about this in De Rosa’s book because it’s full of lies and suppressed truth.
Good grief, man – do your HOMEWORK . . .
And, as for being a Pro Abortion advocate – you ARE.
Jesus said:

Matt. 12:30
Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters.

When you are being judged and he asks you what you did to stop the slaughter of His innocent ones - what are you going to say to Him??
“You’re wrong Lord! It was just a blob of cells!!”

Good luck with that . . .

 

[DNB]

Supporting your hypothesis against abortion is not necessary, because it is not Biblical.

You're stubborn as a mule!
If you read the entire post, which I'm sure that you did but are unable to reply, you'll understand that not every sin under the sun is addressed in scripture.

 

[Stan B]

You're stubborn as a mule!
If you read the entire post, which I'm sure that you did but are unable to reply, you'll understand that not every sin under the sun is addressed in scripture.

There is nothing to reply to. I am in no way interested in the additions you have written to the Bible. If God chose to leave the issue of abortion out of the Bible , I am sure that represents HIS will!

 

[DNB]

There is nothing to reply to. I am in no way interested in the additions you have written to the Bible. If God chose to leave the issue of abortion out of the Bible , I am sure that represents HIS will!

Very bizarre interpretive practice, completely unqualified!

 

[Illuminator]

Psalm 139
13 For it was you who formed my inward parts;
you knit me together in my mother’s womb.
14 I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made.
Wonderful are your works; that I know very well.

 

[Illuminator]

It’s normal to grieve a pregnancy loss, including the loss of a child by abortion. It can form a hole in one’s heart, a hole so deep that sometimes it seems nothing can fill the emptiness.
You are not alone…

Project Rachel - HopeAfterAbortion.org

• Women who have had an abortion have an 81% higher risk of subsequent mental health problems compared to women who have not had an abortion.
• Women who aborted have a 138% higher risk of mental health problems compared to women who have given birth.
• Women who aborted have a 55% higher risk of mental health problems compared to women with an “unplanned” pregnancy who gave birth.
• Women with a history of abortion have higher rates of anxiety (34% higher), depression (37%), alcohol use/misuse (110%), marijuana use (230%), and suicidal behavior (155%), compared to those who have not had an abortion.

Adverse Psychological Reactions: A Fact Sheet | Project Rachel - HopeAfterAbortion.org

bottom line: Stan B hates women.






http://hopeafterabortion.com/?p=109

 

[Renniks]

You cannot die from an abortion if you have never been a living being. A fetus expelled in an abortion, is not a living being.

The non-biblical anti-abortion cult, is just a religion of their own fantasies.

Nowhere does the Bible ever say "Thou shalt not have an abortion!!"

Psalm 139:13 For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother’s womb. 14 I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well. 15 My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place, when I was woven together in the depths of the earth. 16 Your eyes saw my unformed body; all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be.

 

[Stan B]

Psalm 139:13 For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother’s womb. 14 I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well. 15 My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place, when I was woven together in the depths of the earth. 16 Your eyes saw my unformed body; all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be.

No big deal! He knew us all, those whom "He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world . . ." Ephesians 1:4

Simply, He knew everything that would happen before the foundation of the world. He knew who would be born and who wouldn't. He knew who would be aborted by God Himself and others. God facilitates abortions, called spontaneous abortions, or miscarriages. God wouldn't do something sinful would He??

An unformed body is not a living being. It does not become a living being until birth, when God breathes into it the breath/spirit of life, it is a dead pile of dirt, "the body apart from the spirit is dead. James 2:26

 

[Renniks]

No big deal! He knew us all, those whom "He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world . . ." Ephesians 1:4

Simply, He knew everything that would happen before the foundation of the world. He knew who would be born and who wouldn't. He knew who would be aborted by God Himself and others. God facilitates abortions, called spontaneous abortions, or miscarriages. God wouldn't do something sinful would He??

An unformed body is not a living being. It does not become a living being until birth, when God breathes into it the breath/spirit of life, it is a dead pile of dirt, "the body apart from the spirit is dead. James 2:26

He's a baby, a living being, long before he is born. Do you not have children? Did you not feel the baby moving in his mother's womb and listen to his heartbeat before he was born? Pretending his is not a human is absurd. Abortion is killing a human being.

 

[Helen]

An unformed body is not a living being. It does not become a living being until birth, when God breathes into it the breath/spirit of life, it is a dead pile of dirt, "the body apart from the spirit is dead. James 2:26

Hi Stan, you seem quite sure of this.

Personally I wouldn't risk standing where you stand on this issue.
You may just be wrong.
I think God sees things differently.

IMHO

 

[Stan B]

He's a baby, a living being, long before he is born. Do you not have children? Did you not feel the baby moving in his mother's womb and listen to his heartbeat before he was born? Pretending his is not a human is absurd. Abortion is killing a human being.

Have it your way, but the Bible declares numerous times that the blob of dirt in a womb is not a living being until God breathes into it the breath of life. Flesh and blood do not inherit eternal life, only the spirit does, and the lifeless pile of dirt in the womb returns to the ground from whence it came.

God forms man from a pile of dust. It has no life on it's own, it is created merely as a body to contain and convey the spirit of man. Then when the fetus is fully formed, God gives man his spirit, when He breathes into man's the nostrils the breath of life, and he becomes a living being. And then when death comes:

"Man's body returns to the dust from whence it came; And the spirit returns to God who gave it." Ecclesiastes 12:7

Job declares:

“Behold, I belong to God like you;
I too have been formed out of the clay."
“The Spirit of God has made me,

"the breath of the Almighty gives me life." Job 33

"Till I die I will not put away my integrity from me.
For as long as life is in me,
And the breath of God is in my nostrils" Job 27

If your Bible says that a fetus is a living being, you must have a different Bible than I do!

 

[Renniks]

Have it your way, but the Bible declares numerous times that the blob of dirt in a womb is not a living being until God breathes into it the breath of life. Flesh and blood do not inherit eternal life, only the spirit does, and the lifeless pile of dirt in the womb returns to the ground from whence it came.

God forms man from a pile of dust. It has no life on it's own, it is created merely as a body to contain and convey the spirit of man. Then when the fetus is fully formed, God gives man his spirit, when He breathes into man's the nostrils the breath of life, and he becomes a living being. And then when death comes:

"Man's body returns to the dust from whence it came; And the spirit returns to God who gave it." Ecclesiastes 12:7

Job declares:

“Behold, I belong to God like you;
I too have been formed out of the clay."
“The Spirit of God has made me,

"the breath of the Almighty gives me life." Job 33

"Till I die I will not put away my integrity from me.
For as long as life is in me,
And the breath of God is in my nostrils" Job 27

If your Bible says that a fetus is a living being, you must have a different Bible than I do!

The verse I quoted says God knit our inmost being together while we were still in the womb. What do you think our inmost being is? Our soul! None of the verses you quoted say God only gives us a spirit after birth. And God gives us our days before we are born. To kill that child takes all the days God planned for him away. We don't have the right to do that. Only God has the right to give and take life.

 

[Stan B]

Hi Stan, you seem quite sure of this.

Personally I wouldn't risk standing where you stand on this issue.
You may just be wrong.
I think God sees things differently.

I don't stand anywhere on this issue apart from that which is revealed in Scripture. I have never heard from an anti-abortionist who was able to produce a scrap of Scripture to support their activism. Surely if God was anti-abortion, He would have said so in Scripture?? But amongst His some 613 laws, there is no mention of abortion. Is God incompetent? Or has He fully provided His will? That's how cults start; those who add to Scripture something they figure God missed!

I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues which are written in this book; Rev 22:18

What do you figure is the correct approach?

 

[Stan B]

The verse I quoted says God knit our inmost being together while we were still in the womb. What do you think our inmost being is? Our soul! None of the verses you quoted say God only gives us a spirit after birth. And God gives us our days before we are born. To kill that child takes all the days God planned for him away. We don't have the right to do that. Only God has the right to give and take life.

No! God does not give us our days before we were born . . . if we were not going to be born; at least not with the fetus that is in this womb, but another fetus He has prepared to accept our spirit, the essence of who we really are.

 

[Renniks]

No! God does not give us our days before we were born . . . if we were not going to be born; at least not with the fetus that is in this womb, but another fetus He has prepared to accept our spirit, the essence of who we really are.

Now you are just making stuff up.
Jeremiah 1:5
God has plans for everyone of those unborn kids.

 

[Helen]

I don't know if the new Chinese do , but my son-in-laws mother (born in China ) says that the baby's first birthday is just after they are born.
So many verses speak of God knowing us in the womb ...

Tell a fetus who is screaming as they rip him into bits , that he cannot feel it, and he is just a lump of dead dirt and has no life.

A close friend of mine miscarried twins ...she was alone..she held each one in her each hand, they were so small and tried to live..they cried and wriggled about.
She yelled out of the bathroom window for some road workers to come and help her. It broke her heart..they were her BABIES, they were perfectly formed, not lumps of cells. She was five months pregnant.

 

[Stan B]

I don't know if the new Chinese do , but my son-in-laws mother (born in China ) says that the baby's first birthday is just after they are born.
So many verses speak of God knowing us in the womb ...

Tell a fetus who is screaming as they rip him into bits , that he cannot feel it, and he is just a lump of dead dirt and has no life.

Helen says>>"I don't know if the new Chinese do , but my son-in-laws mother (born in China ) says that the baby's first birthday is just after they are born."

Whatever the Chinese believe, God has declared in Scripture that one does not become a living being until God breathes into them the breath of life. Do you disagree with God on that issue?

Helen says>> "So many verses speak of God knowing us in the womb ..."

No! He actually knew us even before the foundation of the world "He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world . . ." Ephesians 1:4

Helen says>> "Tell a fetus who is screaming as they rip him into bits, that he cannot feel it, and he is just a lump of dead dirt and has no life."

Confirmed by James "For as the body apart from the spirit is dead" James 2:26

And of course, a fetus, with lungs filled with amniotic fluid cannot scream, because they have no breath. And breath/life only comes after God breathes into a being the breath of life:
(Genesis 2:7). Adam did not become a living being until then. God breathed into his nostrils of man his spirit, which who a person really is. The body dies and returns to dust, while the spirit lives on forever.

In all fairness Helen, this is not a topic in which I have ever had the slightest interest, but it was imposed upon me via a local church forum in which I engage. My first red flag alert came when people engaged upon an anti-abortion rant. While they made a whole lot of noise, their Biblical authority for such rant was palpably non-Scriptural. And when asked for their authority they couldn't provide any.

So . . I am stuck with rejecting a totally unsupportable, non-Scriptural ideology. :-(

So, Helen, Should I accept the idealogy of this non-Biblical cult, or should I focus solely upon what the Scriptures say?