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what do you mean you don't understand it, must you consult with shawn first ?I would have to do a proper study reading all of 1 Peter and getting to that point Sir.
So I don’t know what it means right now at this moment, perhaps I’ll get back to you on that.
shake the dust off your feet before going to bed :)I'm off to bed...it's starting to feel like I'm casting pearls before swine.
what do you mean you don't understand it, must you consult with shawn first ?
any believer can understand Peters simple instruction in the passage
what does your mom have to do with you understanding the passage ?Yeah okay ask my mom that question.
This is not rocket science. There are just TWO DESTINATIONS. Heaven or Hades. Souls and spirits are imperishable, and they continue to live in either of those two regions. But those in Hades await their final judgment.where do people go when they die?
No such thing as an immortal soul. This concept is foreign to the Bible and was borrowed by early Christians from Greek Philosophers. When we die we are dead. For life, we await the resurrection.Why do people not believe in the immortal soul? The soul (spirit of Man/Woman) is composed of (mind/will/emotion) of an individual that is housed inside of a body - that is formed in the womb of the woman, that is created by God (of course some factors of what a person does to their body while pregnant does cause some problems during creation of the baby inside of the womb.)
- Ecclesiastes 12:7 And the dust returneth to the earth as it was, And the spirit returneth to God who gave it.
- Matthew 10:28 And be not afraid of those killing the body, and are not able to kill the soul, but fear rather Him who is able both soul and body to destroy in gehenna.
- Luke 12:20 `And God said to him, Unthinking one! this night thy soul they shall require from thee, and what things thou didst prepare -- to whom shall they be?
- 1 Corinthians 15:54 and when this corruptible may have put on incorruption, and this mortal may have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the word that hath been written, `The Death was swallowed up -- to victory;
Accordingly to scripture - souls live on in the afterlife ; before Jesus Christ and his return souls (or the spirit of man/woman) would reside in Sheol (the covering place of the dead - those who had died and passed away on earth.)
- Revelation 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given to them, and the souls of those who have been beheaded because of the testimony of Jesus, and because of the word of God, and who did not bow before the beast, nor his image, and did not receive the mark upon their forehead and upon their hand, and they did live and reign with Christ the thousand years;
These scriptures make it clear that the soul (spirit of man) continues on after this life that soul is a part of you as a person now today. There are two destinations in my best estimation today, for people to go to that is the Heavenly Realm - being outside of the Kingdom having died not being a child of or a Son or Daughter of God. The second or first however you decide to apply this is in the new Heavenly Jerusalem where God resides inside of the the new spiritual city, according to Revelation 22.
- Revelation 22:14-15
- 14 `Happy are those doing His commands that the authority shall be theirs unto the tree of the life, and by the gates they may enter into the city;
- 15 and without [are] the dogs, and the sorcerers, and the whoremongers, and the murderers, and the idolaters, and every one who is loving and is doing a lie.
Looks like you have become a cultist. Good luck with that.No such thing as an immortal soul. This concept is foreign to the Bible and was borrowed by early Christians from Greek Philosophers. When we die we are dead. For life, we await the resurrection.
The Bible gateway.com offers about 60 translations (one verse at a time) that you can scroll down and examine. But as I said, it was two-fold death, a physical long term dying death of cells, a distorting of the genetic code, corrupting and creating all sorts of illnesses in all living things AND spiritual separation (death) from God.Only 50 :cool:
tn Heb “dying you will die.”
Even the translation note shows the Hebrew.
Its conveying the certainty of death, but not an execution style death on that day.
As as side rather than using your machine gun approach to prove the immortal essence show me a passage of Scripture that teaches the disembodiment of the flesh and spirit - just one for now - your strongest text. Evidence this immortal soul leaves the body as a person.
Good luck.
What do you mean by natural spirit. I think of nature as physical and heaven as spiritual. Nature as in character, okay, invisible spiritual attributes that are manifest in reality.Yet though a body is alive, natural spirit is alive, soul is alive...
~ A man “separated”, body, soul, spirit FROM God is “spiritually dead”.
When they sinned, they were naked! Exposed, in shame and God could no longer walk with them as He did before. He talked to them audibly but it is not clear He walked anymore with them.In the Garden, every day Adam had the Presence of God with him IN that Specific Location.
The moment Adam was escorted OUT of the Garden, he was “separated” from Gods presence. That was the day, (and moment) Adam “died”.
He covered Adam but didn't remove sin. Jesus removed sin from mankind. Jesus sacrifice was imputed to all those OT faithful believers. That is a difficult one, since heaven is outside out time domain. It was already done ... multiple dimensions. ? Like we are somehow transformed in a time machine back to the cross with Christ and died with him. Adam never disbelieved in God, he was just disobedient. His faith was sound as you say because he passed it down to his sons and in essence to Noah.We also note, God forgave Adam (when God covered Adams “sin”, ie flesh body that Sinned Against God. Obviously slaying an animal, “ie sacrifice” for the sin of the mans body, and presumption of the animals blood spilled, (ie the blood was its life), for forgiveness of sin.
A defiled conscience is not a dead conscience!...just needs cleaning Ephesians 5:26
The Bible gateway.com offers about 60 translations (one verse at a time) that you can scroll down and examine. But as I said, it was two-fold death, a physical long term dying death of cells, a distorting of the genetic code, corrupting and creating all sorts of illnesses in all living things AND spiritual separation (death) from God.
Jesus _ on the cross _ said to the thief next to him, "Today, you will be in Paradise"! "You" meaning his spirit. Not in a few thousand years at the resurrection, TODAY.
Jesus also said, to the Father in his last breath, receive my spirit. His body died, but His spirit was very much alive. Or do you think He slept for three days? Then how could he be in Paradise that day?
When Stephen was stoned to death, on his last cry he said, "Lord receive my spirit". That means now, not in 3,000 years.
Paul taught, "To be absent the body is to be present with the Lord". That means when we die, our spirit ( the new creature, the purified essence of our self), goes directly to be with the Lord.
This is a fundamental doctrine in Christianity. If you are not a JW or SDA, I am surprised you question this.
“Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.” John 3:3
>>Christians are in the Kingdom of God, therefore we have been born again. We are a new creature, yet we still have the flesh, our bodies. Our bodies do not pass on, nor does our old self, who died. Our new self passes on – immediately!
“and said, “Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven. Matt.18:3
>> One must be converted before death. We have been converted.
“Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you completely; and may your whole spirit, soul, and body be preserved blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.” 1 Thes. 5:23
>> At our Lord’s coming will be the time of our resurrection. So we will have new bodies as well.
“The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,” Rom. 8:16 >>
"And they stoned Stephen as he was calling on God and saying, 'Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.' ” Acts 7:59 >> His request meant NOW, not in 3,000 years.
"I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago—whether in the body I do not know, or whether out of the body I do not know, God knows—such a one was caught up to the third heaven." 2 Cor. 12:2 >> Either this man’s spirit left his body and saw heaven or had a vision of heaven - Paul was uncertain. The point is, our spirit is able to separate from our bodies and will separate from our bodies at death.
"… Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life." Rev. 2:10 >> When we die, we get a crown at that time, not 1,000 years later; and it’s a promise. When we make a promise to our kids, if you complete your year in school, with good grades, I will take you to Disneyland. When Dad? “ “In twenty years or so … just kidding, how about today or tomorrow or whenever you like?"
"Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?" Rom. 8:35 >> Not even death can separate us. If we didn’t exist or we were just not conscious after death, we would be separated – wouldn’t we?
"For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart." Heb. 4:12 >> If soul and spirit were the same, they couldn’t be separated.
"And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?” John 11:26 >> Do you believe this? We won’t be spiritually separated from God at death.
"Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad.” John 8:56 >> How did Abraham see Jesus’ day unless he was alive in heaven? He has not been resurrected yet, but his spirit is there. Moses and Elijah appeared at the Mt of Transfiguration when Jesus showed his glory. They were spiritually alive, in heaven, not asleep.
That's a machinge gun, it's a simi-automatic rifle.
25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself up for it; 26 that he might sanctify it, having cleansed it by the washing of water with the word, 27 that he might present the church to himself a glorious [church], not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.
>> talking about husbands loving their wives as Christ loves the Church ... as He cleanses it with the word, we should love and forgive our wives though they may go off on a tangent, to play in left field or max out your credit cards! "I forgive you, just don't do it again!" Sanctification is two-fold. It happens instantly when we are born again, a spiritual rebirth. Then gradually the Spirit sanctifies, works to transform our soul and behavior to conform to Christ. Spiritual growth happens as the seed is wated and the sin that dwells in our flesh is mortified.
God is a person, without a body. The Holy Spirit is God, a person, without a body. Christians who die, do not have a body and ascend into heaven, exist, are conscious. This is common Christian theology. Where did you get yours?A lot of quotes about people there but nothing showing a disembodied person.
Disembodied means: separated from or existing without the body.
@Ronald David Bruno We do know that the Lord Jesus has a body (after the Incarnation) - John 1.14; Colossians 2.9; 1 Timothy 3.16 - and that He rose again bodily (1 Corinthians 15).God is a person, without a body. The Holy Spirit is God, a person, without a body. Christians who die, do not have a body and ascend into heaven, exist, are conscious. This is common Christian theology. Where did you get yours?
In Acts 7:59 - Stephen is about to be disembodied and ascend into heaven.
The thief next to Jesus is about to die and his spirit promised to be in Paradise on that day.
2 Cor. 12:2 describes a person either out of their body while visiting heaven or receiving a vision.
Rev. 2:10 - Jesus gives a crown of life to those who have lived a life of faith until death. They are given a crown, without a their dead physical body, yet have an spiritual body in heaven and put it on.
John 8:56 tells us Abraham rejoiced on to see the Messiah come. Abraham died long ago, so he must have seen all this in heaven while it was happening.
You did not deny you were a JW or SDA. ?? If someone suspected that I was either, I would quickly correct them, though I would be in agreement with much of the SDA theology, just not concerning soul sleep.
What do you mean by natural spirit. I think of nature as physical and heaven as spiritual. Nature as in character, okay, invisible spiritual attributes that are manifest in reality.
When they sinned, they were naked! Exposed, in shame and God could no longer walk with them as He did before. He talked to them audibly but it is not clear He walked anymore with them.
He covered Adam but didn't remove sin. Jesus removed sin from mankind. Jesus sacrifice was imputed to all those OT faithful believers.
That is a difficult one, since heaven is outside out time domain. It was already done ... multiple dimensions. ? Like we are somehow transformed in a time machine back to the cross with Christ and died with him. Adam never disbelieved in God, he was just disobedient. His faith was sound as you say because he passed it down to his sons and in essence to Noah.
Why do people not believe in the immortal soul? The soul (spirit of Man/Woman) is composed of (mind/will/emotion) of an individual that is housed inside of a body - that is formed in the womb of the woman, that is created by God (of course some factors of what a person does to their body while pregnant does cause some problems during creation of the baby inside of the womb.)