Jesus is Michael

[Keiw]

Let us( YHWH and his master worker) create man in our image.
The speaker at Proverbs 8 is the one YHWH sent to earth and was named Jesus as a mortal. His master worker. No other deserves that title but the one whom God created all other things through. It says grew especially fond of me, And the speaker advises all listen to him. It also shows God created him. Which goes along with Collosians 1:15-- The firstborn of all creation--The term all creation proves he was the first creation.
Daniel 12:1--Michael stands up for the sons of Daniel( Israel) He did that as a man named Jesus but they rejected him. Upon Jesus return he comes with the voice of the archangel( 1Thess 4:16) it is his voice. In Revelation Michael rides the white horse( war in heaven) that ride continues and it shows Jesus on that horse coming to earth leading Gods armies. The ride does not stop until this-1Corinthians 15:24-28-- Jesus hands back the kingdom to his God and Father and subjects himself.--- God does not have a God--God is in subjection to no one.
JESUS IS MICHAEL. God sent his best.

The LORD( YHWH) said to my Lord( Jesus) -- proving Jesus is not YHWH.

 

[marks]

Let us( YHWH and his master worker) create man in our image.
The speaker at Proverbs 8 is the one YHWH sent to earth and was named Jesus as a mortal. His master worker. No other deserves that title but the one whom God created all other things through. It says grew especially fond of me, And the speaker advises all listen to him. It also shows God created him. Which goes along with Collosians 1:15-- The firstborn of all creation--The term all creation proves he was the first creation.
Daniel 12:1--Michael stands up for the sons of Daniel( Israel) He did that as a man named Jesus but they rejected him. Upon Jesus return he comes with the voice of the archangel( 1Thess 4:16) it is his voice. In Revelation Michael rides the white horse( war in heaven) that ride continues and it shows Jesus on that horse coming to earth leading Gods armies. The ride does not stop until this-1Corinthians 15:24-28-- Jesus hands back the kingdom to his God and Father and subjects himself.--- God does not have a God--God is in subjection to no one.
JESUS IS MICHAEL. God sent his best.

The LORD( YHWH) said to my Lord( Jesus) -- proving Jesus is not YHWH.

I appreciate your clarity over your view. I'll try to keep this in mind as I may have occasion to discuss things with you.

I'm curious . . . who was it the elders of Israel ate a meal with on Mount Sinai? In Zechariah 14, who will stand with His feet upon the Mount of Olives? There are many more questions like that, but there are two.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Hebrews 1:5-6 KJV
5) For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?
6) And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

 

[Keiw]

I appreciate your clarity over your view. I'll try to keep this in mind as I may have occasion to discuss things with you.

I'm curious . . . who was it the elders of Israel ate a meal with on Mount Sinai? In Zechariah 14, who will stand with His feet upon the Mount of Olives? There are many more questions like that, but there are two.

Much love!

The bible says its YHWH(Jehovah)-- what does that have to do with my post?

Hebrews 1:5-6 KJV
5) For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?
6) And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

The greek word translated in your bible for worship was translated from Proskenaue- Means to bow and kiss the feet. To Gods king, that is why they bowed. They were not expecting God, they were expecting Gods king.
The day coming belonging to Jehovah is Har-Mageddon( 14:3) in Zechariah. YHWH does it through Jesus always. Acts 2:22--but it is still YHWH(Jehovahs) day. (John 5:30--Jesus can do 0 of his own inititive. Lords prayer--The kingdom, power and glory all belong to the Father( YHWH(Jehovah)-- the meal is probably symbolic. The bible teaches--no man has ever seen God. John 1:18

 

[marks]

the meal is probably symbolic.

OK. They ate a meal with God, but not really. Got it.

God is Spirit . . . Who will stand with their feet upon the Mount of Olives?

All the angels were commanded to worship Jesus. All the angels. All.

Much love!

 

[Enoch111]

The LORD( YHWH) said to my Lord( Jesus) -- proving Jesus is not YHWH.

Another anti-Trinitarian who is totally clueless. Michael is an archangel, while Jesus is God.

 

[Keiw]

OK. They ate a meal with God, but not really. Got it.

God is Spirit . . . Who will stand with their feet upon the Mount of Olives?

All the angels were commanded to worship Jesus. All the angels. All.

Much love!

The greek word used as worship by catholicism is proskenaue--to bow and kiss the feet it translates--look it up
They bowed to their king.

 

[Keiw]

Another anti-Trinitarian who is totally clueless. Michael is an archangel, while Jesus is God.

Jesus was antitrinitarian as well--John 20:17, Rev 3:12--so was Paul-1Cor 8:6There is one God to all the Father. Your translations teach 2 different Gods because of errors.
There is no division in Jesus 1 single religion that he started-1Cor 1:10

Tell us all then-who is Gods master worker? When did Michael stand up for the sons of Daniel( Israel) since you know i am wrong, you must have the explanation.

 

[marks]

The greek word used as worship by catholicism is proskenaue--to bow and kiss the feet it translates--look it up
They bowed to their king.

Yes, I know that word, but you are not actually responding to my posts.

All the angels of God. You would have the archangel Michael being commanded to worship himself. Is that what you have in mind?

Much love!

 

[marks]

Which goes along with Collosians 1:15-- The firstborn of all creation--The term all creation proves he was the first creation.

By Him, all things were created. Jesus did not "create Himself". Rather, He is the Creator.

As we know from other Scriptures, "firstborn" is applied beyond simply the first to come from the womb, but others are set as "firstborn" in a position of eminence.

Much love!

 

[Keiw]

Yes, I know that word, but you are not actually responding to my posts.

All the angels of God. You would have the archangel Michael being commanded to worship himself. Is that what you have in mind?

Much love!

It just means the rest of the angels--Archangel is chief of the angels. They should bow to him. God appointed him king. If he were God he was already king and wouldnt have to be appointed, nor would he have to hand it back and subject himself-1Cor 15:24-28

 

[Keiw]

By Him, all things were created. Jesus did not "create Himself". Rather, He is the Creator.

As we know from other Scriptures, "firstborn" is applied beyond simply the first to come from the womb, but others are set as "firstborn" in a position of eminence.

Much love!

It says all creation-- Creation of the angels occurred before the earth-- All creation proves he was Gods first creation like it says and he tells you in Prov 8.
And The LORD(YHWH9Jehovah) said to my Lord( Jesus) proves Jesus is not YHWH. And it also says in the OT--I am YHWH(Jehovah) beside me( not we) there is no other God.

 

[farouk]

In Psalm 110, the Lord indeed sits at the right hand of God, victorious: this belongs truly the Son of God, victor at the Cross.

(There is a false premise from the start of the thread.)

 

[Keiw]

In Psalm 110, the Lord indeed sits at the right hand of God, victorious: this belongs truly the Son of God, victor at the Cross.

(There is a false premise from the start of the thread.)

Lord, not LORD( YHWH) and he sits at the right hand of God--There is only 1 God. One cannot sit at their own right hand.

 

[farouk]

Lord, not LORD( YHWH) and he sits at the right hand of God--There is only 1 God. One cannot sit at their own right hand.

Incorrect.

The Lord Jesus is gloriously and eternally God: Hebrews chapter 1 triumphantly declares it:

"1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;


3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

4 Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.

5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

10 And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:

11 They shall perish; but thou remainest; and they all shall wax old as doth a garment;

12 And as a vesture shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.

13 But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?

14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?"

 

[Keiw]

Incorrect.

The Lord Jesus is gloriously and eternally God: Hebrews chapter 1 triumphantly declares it:

"1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;


3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

4 Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.

5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

10 And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:

11 They shall perish; but thou remainest; and they all shall wax old as doth a garment;

12 And as a vesture shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.

13 But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?

14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?"

trinity translations teach 2 different gods--1Cor 8:6--There is one God to all, the Father-- (not Father, son, holy spirit)
John 4:22-24-- Jesus warns all about the God they serve then tells all his Fathers will--The Father( not Father, son and holy spirit) is searching to be worshipped in spirit and truth. The capitol G GOD in the last line at John 1:1 is proven error.

 

[farouk]

trinity translations teach 2 different gods--1Cor 8:6--There is one God to all, the Father-- (not Father, son, holy spirit)
John 4:22-24-- Jesus warns all about the God they serve then tells all his Fathers will--The Father( not Father, son and holy spirit) is searching to be worshipped in spirit and truth. The capitol G GOD in the last line at John 1:1 is proven error.

Wrong. Wrong. Wrong.

(*Ignore.)

 

[Keiw]

Wrong. Wrong. Wrong.

(*Ignore.)

No i am not wrong. Catholicism admits in their own encyclopedia no trinity was ever served until near the end of the 4th century.

The new Catholic encyclopedia-1967-Vol XIV-Page 299--- The formulation of one God in three persons was not established certainly not fully assimilated into christian life and its profession of faith until near the end of the 4th century. Among the Apostolc fathers, there had been nothing even remotely approaching such a mentality or perspective.
And that is truth-- In the 2nd century a man named tertullian was considering God being a trinity, Why? Because a single being God of Israel was still being served. At the first council of Nicea in 325 no trinity was taught or served--These are facts. It was created at a council, it is not truth. No trinity exists. That religion translated errors in to fit their false council teachings.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Yes, I know that word, but you are not actually responding to my posts.

All the angels of God. You would have the archangel Michael being commanded to worship himself. Is that what you have in mind?

You are twisting words here....The Greek word pro·sky·neʹo corresponds closely to the Hebrew term hish·ta·chawahʹ in expressing the thought of obeisance, (bowing in reverent respect) and, at times, worship. I am unaware of any command of God to bow with one's face to the earth when worshipping Jehovah.

Context determines whether it means 'obeisance' or 'worship'. If it is directed to a man, it is obeisance.....
If it is directed to God, it is worship.

When Jesus was in human form, it was obeisance (otherwise it is blasphemous to bow in worship to one who is not God.) When the magi came to give gifts to the child Jesus, they did not "worship" him as a god but as the new "King of the Jews". He was in human form and they did not believe that he was anything but a new king.

There is no single scripture that describes Jesus as anything but a man. Never does Jesus say that he is God incarnate. He had to be 100% human in order to redeem mankind. If he was God, then he was an immortal who could not die. If Christ did not die the same death as Adam, then the equivalency necessary to pay the ransom was not met.

Michael is not just an Angel, but "The Archangel" or one who is in command of the angelic forces. Michael is a Prince according to Daniel so he is no ordinary angel.
As God's first creation (Revelation 3:14) the pre-human Jesus was the first and only direct creation of his Father, making him unique.
According to Colossians this "firstborn" son was then used as the agent of creation in bringing all other things into existence.
He is described in Proverbs 8:30-31 as God's "Master Workman". He was the "us" and "our" in Genesis ch 1.

By Him, all things were created. Jesus did not "create Himself". Rather, He is the Creator.

No...read it again....
"He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. 16 For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him. 17 And he is before all things, and in him all things hold together."

Jesus is an "image" of his Father.....an image is not the real thing. I can show you a photo of my mother but the image is not her.
If my mother had a twin sister I could show you an image of her sister and she would look exactly like my mother.
The other problem you have with that verse is, how can you have an image of something that is invisible?

John 1:2 also confirms that the son acted as an agent for his Father....
"He was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made."
"Through him" is not the same as saying that Jesus is the Creator.....what the son did was fashion creation, working at his Father's side, and under his Father's instructions.

As we know from other Scriptures, "firstborn" is applied beyond simply the first to come from the womb, but others are set as "firstborn" in a position of eminence.

Yes....so its not saying that the son is equal to his superior Father though, is it? "Firstborn" (bᵊḵôr) in the Bible is used with regard to any "firstborn" of human kind and animals.

The term "only begotten" (monogenes) is also used with reference to Jesus....so is this a word used exclusively for God's son? The answer again, is NO. An "only begotten" child in the scriptures describes a child with no siblings. This child needed a 'begetter' because no one can have a Father who did not beget them. This reinforces the fact that Jesus is not God, but a creation of his God and Father.

Any way you look at it, Jesus is not God....so there is no reason why Jesus cannot be Michael....another role with another name. Jesus has many names and was given a new one on his return to heaven. (Philippians 2:9; Revelation 3:14)

 

[ReChoired]

... No other deserves that title but the one whom God created all other things through. ...

Can you provide the scripture (Isaiah 8:20 KJB) for that statement please?

Can you speak with me on your subject? I only ask, if you do, that assumption is left out as much as possible, and give me room to ask you about your position, or to explain my position, from scripture (KJB)