The End Time sequence of Events...

[Hobie]

So what will be the order of end time events in which these things shall happen, the Close of Probation and sealing of the 144000. the time such as never was, the Seven Last Plagues, and the 'false christ' showing up before the Second Coming of Christ. So where are we now and what do we have coming to the time of the end.

We have already begun with the signs with the fires and floods and pandemic but there is worse to come as we see the new world order unite saying its to combat these events, but there purpose is for a different reason. Revelation describes the whore of Babylon and we see that the leaders of this world will unite and give their power and support to the this AntiChrist power, apostate church, and then this new world order will be in a position ready to enforce the mark of the beast.

Revelation 17:17
For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.

The Mark of the Beast will be enforced by what can only be the force of law on the whole world and people will have to choose. Revelation 13 tells us that the mark of the beast will be enforced upon the whole world ...
Revelation 13:16
And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:

The new world order governments will unite in convincing the world that the mark of the beast will be the "solution" to the world's problems, much as we see with these laws on 'climate change'. They will convince the world that all these troubles are the judgments of God because of us not following Him and then insert the deception of what they want the world to do.

Now before anyone chooses for or against the mark of the beast, God, through His remnant on earth will send a final message to the world. This message contained in the three angel's messages of Revelation 14 is God's last call of mercy to the world.

Revelation 14:8-11
8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.
9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
'
So the choice as to receiving the Mark of the Beast comes now and probation closes. Once everyone have made their decision for the mark of the beast or the seal of God, then the door of mercy will close and everyone will be judged either righteous or filthy ...
Revelation 22:11
He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.

Then we shall see a time of trouble, like we have newer seen before, the great tribulation prophesied in Daniel..
Daniel 12:1
And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

Then come Seven Last Plagues as now that everyone has decided which side they will follow, either that of Christ or the beast, God's final judgments can begin to fall upon this world, in the form of the seven last plagues. These plagues will be the wrath of God..
Revelation 14:10
The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

Revelation 14:19
And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

Then will come the Battle of Armageddon which is the final world battle and will happen when Jesus Christ returns,,,
Revelation 19:15
And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

We will then have the second coming of Christ will be a world wide, visible event as He comes with all His angels. Jesus will return in unimaginable glory to deliver His people. There will be no secret rapture like so many believe, as the Bible clearly states that EVERY EYE will see Jesus return, and that His second coming will be a seen and heard by the whole world.
Revelation 1:7
Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

We will then have the Resurrection of the saints lying asleep in the graves and the 144,000 living saints at the second coming, the graves will burst open and the righteous will rise up and together with the saints who have gone through the great tribulation and are still alive, will meet Jesus in the air ...
1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Now this is the 'first resurrection' and the wicked or the rest of the dead (lost sinners) will not live again until the 1000 years are over ...
Revelation 20:5
But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

The saints and the 144,000 go to heaven with Christ and His angels and only after 1000 Year Millennium in heaven does the New Jerusalem come down to earth, and the wicked burn in the lake of fire. Contrary to what many have been told, we do not spend the 1000 years on earth wandering about with the wicked...

Revelation 20:6-8
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

After the 1000 years in Heaven, we return to this earth in the New Jerusalem and the wicked are resurrected and Satan gathers them together to fight and take the New Jerusalem ...
Revelation 20:9-10
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

So the wicked are thrown into the lake of fire, where they are consumed and cease to exist in the second death, and even Satan himself is finally destroyed and will cease to exist.
Revelation 20:14-15
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Revelation 21:8
But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

 

[Keraz]

You miss what is plainly the next Prophesied event: the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster which will set the scene for all the Prophesied things to take place, leading up to the glorious Return of Jesus.
There has to be some kind of dramatic event to force the nations to cede their sovereignty and form a One World Govt. Daniel 7:23-25

 

[Hobie]

The New England Dark Day, May 19, 1780 - New England Historical Society

The New England Dark Day was literally the darkest day of the American Revolution. Did an eclipse cause it? The wrath of God?

newenglandhistoricalsociety.com

The Night the Stars Fell: The 1833 Meteor Shower » Explorersweb

It was the night the stars fell. In 1833, people scattered across North America witnessed a powerful celestial event that appeared downright apocalyptic.

explorersweb.com

Lisbon earthquake 1755 - New World Encyclopedia

www.newworldencyclopedia.org

 

[ScottA]

So what will be the order of end time events in which these things shall happen, the Close of Probation and sealing of the 144000. the time such as never was, the Seven Last Plagues, and the 'false christ' showing up before the Second Coming of Christ. So where are we now and what do we have coming to the time of the end.

We have already begun with the signs with the fires and floods and pandemic but there is worse to come as we see the new world order unite saying its to combat these events, but there purpose is for a different reason. Revelation describes the whore of Babylon and we see that the leaders of this world will unite and give their power and support to the this AntiChrist power, apostate church, and then this new world order will be in a position ready to enforce the mark of the beast.

Revelation 17:17
For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.

The Mark of the Beast will be enforced by what can only be the force of law on the whole world and people will have to choose. Revelation 13 tells us that the mark of the beast will be enforced upon the whole world ...
Revelation 13:16
And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:

The new world order governments will unite in convincing the world that the mark of the beast will be the "solution" to the world's problems, much as we see with these laws on 'climate change'. They will convince the world that all these troubles are the judgments of God because of us not following Him and then insert the deception of what they want the world to do.

Now before anyone chooses for or against the mark of the beast, God, through His remnant on earth will send a final message to the world. This message contained in the three angel's messages of Revelation 14 is God's last call of mercy to the world.

Revelation 14:8-11
8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.
9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
'
So the choice as to receiving the Mark of the Beast comes now and probation closes. Once everyone have made their decision for the mark of the beast or the seal of God, then the door of mercy will close and everyone will be judged either righteous or filthy ...
Revelation 22:11
He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.

Then we shall see a time of trouble, like we have newer seen before, the great tribulation prophesied in Daniel..
Daniel 12:1
And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

Then come Seven Last Plagues as now that everyone has decided which side they will follow, either that of Christ or the beast, God's final judgments can begin to fall upon this world, in the form of the seven last plagues. These plagues will be the wrath of God..
Revelation 14:10
The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

Revelation 14:19
And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

Then will come the Battle of Armageddon which is the final world battle and will happen when Jesus Christ returns,,,
Revelation 19:15
And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

We will then have the second coming of Christ will be a world wide, visible event as He comes with all His angels. Jesus will return in unimaginable glory to deliver His people. There will be no secret rapture like so many believe, as the Bible clearly states that EVERY EYE will see Jesus return, and that His second coming will be a seen and heard by the whole world.
Revelation 1:7
Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

We will then have the Resurrection of the saints lying asleep in the graves and the 144,000 living saints at the second coming, the graves will burst open and the righteous will rise up and together with the saints who have gone through the great tribulation and are still alive, will meet Jesus in the air ...
1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Now this is the 'first resurrection' and the wicked or the rest of the dead (lost sinners) will not live again until the 1000 years are over ...
Revelation 20:5
But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

The saints and the 144,000 go to heaven with Christ and His angels and only after 1000 Year Millennium in heaven does the New Jerusalem come down to earth, and the wicked burn in the lake of fire. Contrary to what many have been told, we do not spend the 1000 years on earth wandering about with the wicked...

Revelation 20:6-8
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

After the 1000 years in Heaven, we return to this earth in the New Jerusalem and the wicked are resurrected and Satan gathers them together to fight and take the New Jerusalem ...
Revelation 20:9-10
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

So the wicked are thrown into the lake of fire, where they are consumed and cease to exist in the second death, and even Satan himself is finally destroyed and will cease to exist.
Revelation 20:14-15
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Revelation 21:8
But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

Those who wish to know what is included in the end times, should not first read the last chapters, but rather read the first chapters first...for the days (times) of creation are the forward, preview, and prophecy...which many end times theories cannot be reconciled with.

 

[Hobie]

Well lets line it up and see what we can agree on..
1. We are with wars on every side and America has been trying to bring about what it itself has called a New World Order.

2. Another huge crisis above the economic troubles, uprisings, riots, wars, earthquakes, tsunamis, volcanos erupting, "terrorism", famine. As there is yet another possible beyond these such as Iran or North Korea setting of a nuclear device.

3. The "Kings of the Earth" give their support to what in Revelation 17 describes as the whore of Babylon which I think we can all agree is a apostate church, and then the world will be in a position ready to enforce the mark of the beast.

4. The Mark of the Beast enforced by law as this is a major Bible prophecy end time event to be fulfilled. Revelation 13 tells us that the mark of the beast will be enforced upon the whole world as you can see with the various world agencies taking over every issue, this is not hard to see.

5. The King of the North appears which is a power against the people of God that we are told in Daniel 11:45.

6. The Three Angel's Messages proclaimed to the world, as before anyone chooses for or against the mark of the beast, God, sends a final message to the world in the three angel's messages of Revelation 14..

7. Then a choice for the Seal or Mark in which every man, woman and child on earth will have to make one final choice. A choice to take the side of Christ Jesus and receive the seal of God from either economic pressure and fear of persecution from the world, take the mark of the beast as we see in Revelation 13:16.

8. Probation closes as once everyone have made their decision for the mark of the beast or the seal of God, then the door of mercy and grace will close and everyone will be judged either righteous or filthy.

9. Then a Time of Trouble for the world that we have never seen with earth shattering events not just about leaders or governments.

10. Then we have the Seven Last Plagues as God's final judgments begin to fall upon this world, in the form of the seven last plagues. These plagues will be the "wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture." as mentioned in Revelation 14:10.

11. The Battle of Armageddon: - This is the final world battle will happen when Jesus Christ returns as "KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS" to defeat Satan and his hosts and to deliver the saints.

12. The Second Coming of Christ Jesus with every eye seeing Him in the clouds as He comets to take the saints to heaven.

13. Then we have the resurrection of the Saints and the 144,000 living Saints as Jesus Christ raises those in the graves and those living saints at the second coming. And as it says the rest of the dead or wicked will not live again until the 1000 years are over, Revelation 20:5

14. We then have the 1000 Year Millennium as Christ takes the saints home to the Heavenly Kingdom and the New Jerusalem, and there we dwell for 1000 years, while Satan is bound to this desolate earth with no one to tempt.

15. Then the destruction of the Wicked after the 1000 years when the saints and Christ return to this earth in the New Jerusalem. The wicked are resurrected and Satan gathers them together to fight and take the New Jerusalem but are defeated and meet their end in the Lake of Fire where the wicked are thrown in and are consumed and cease to exist. And scripture tells us that Satan himself is finally destroyed and will cease to exist.

 

[Arthur81]

It strikes me as totally inconsistent for the futurist/literalist to concoct all of his theories, but ignore the plain statements of the book itself:

"The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show unto his servants, even the things which must shortly come to pass: and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John; who bare witness of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, even of all things that he saw. Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of the prophecy, and keep the things that are written therein: for the time is at hand." (Rev 1:1-3 ASV)

Then for emphasis repeated in the last chapter:

And he said unto me, These words are faithful and true: and the Lord, the God of the spirits of the prophets, sent his angel to show unto his servants the things which must shortly come to pass...And he saith unto me, Seal not up the words of the prophecy of this book; for the time is at hand. (Rev 22:6, 10 ASV)

I can see that compatible with a preterist view of Revelation or a Church History view of Revelation. But, that timing cannot be compatible with the Futurist view. The literalist/futurist suddenly reach for the figurative and symbolic to justify their silly notions. For centuries men have been date setters and proven to be frauds. The same is true today.

 

[Keraz]

For centuries men have been date setters and proven to be frauds. The same is true today.

This does not mean that what is Prophesied will never happen. It is just that we fallible humans have been too keen for the Lord to bring in on, but all in His good timing.
We can understand why the Lord has made it impossible for us to know exactly when He will rise up and destroy His enemies. However, we can know the season and it should be evident to all that we are now very close to the commencement of all that is Prophesied for the latter days.
Knowing what the Lord will use to change the world, would be a big help in getting thru it all.

 

[Timtofly]

7. Then a choice for the Seal or Mark in which every man, woman and child on earth will have to make one final choice. A choice to take the side of Christ Jesus and receive the seal of God from either economic pressure and fear of persecution from the world, take the mark of the beast as we see in Revelation 13:16.

The choice is between the mark and being beheaded.

 

[Hobie]

The choice is between the mark and being beheaded.

Well, lets stick with the scripture..

Revelation 19:20
And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

 

[Timtofly]

Well, lets stick with the scripture..

Revelation 19:20
And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Revelation 20:4

"I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands."

One is either beheaded without the mark, or have a head with the mark.

Those who got the victory were removed prior to the point the mark was given. Which by the way happens when God removes one's name from the Lamb's book of life. Those sealed were removed and waiting on the sea of glass. That sea of glass is not a place on earth.

Of course all those with the mark were destroyed in Revelation 19. No one is left in Adam's dead corruptible flesh. All are killed or tossed into the LOF.

The goats were tossed into the LOF. Matthew 25

"Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:"

"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment:"

That is the LOF. Even death and sheol will be cast into everlasting fire, everlasting punishment, the LOF.

Even the tares are gathered and cast into the LOF. Matthew 13:40-42

"As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."

These all are gathered before even the mark itself is placed on humanity by God, after the final harvest.

Those beheaded and those with the mark are the very last thousands if not millions left on earth after the final harvest. The goats are removed during the first 6 Trumpets. The tares are removed during the 7 Thunders. Those 13 judgments are the time of the final harvest. Both Jesus and His angels will be on earth removing both the redeemed and the unrighteous. Those with the mark and those beheaded are just the gleanings left over from the main harvest. That final 8th mystery Babylonian Empire will not be that spectacular.

 

[Davy]

The actual SIGNS of the end leading up to Lord Jesus' future return are given by Lord Jesus Himself in His Olivet discourse of Matthew 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21. There Jesus gave 7 main SIGNS of the end leading up to His future coming and gathering of His faithful Church. The SEALS of Revelation 6 are a parallel to those SIGNS He gave, and should be studied together with His Olivet discourse SIGNS.

Here is a link to that Bible study I did line upon line, on those SIGNS and SEALS in parallel:

Christ's Olivet Discourse, Line upon Line

Line upon line is God's Way to study His Word. Here is the proper interpretation of Christ's Olivet discourse of the Signs of the end He gave His disciples while upon the Mount of Olives with them. The Signs He gave directly parallel the Seals of Revelation 6, so that should be studied in...

www.christianityboard.com

 

[ewq1938]

The saints and the 144,000 go to heaven with Christ and His angels

This isn't in the bible. Pretrib claims the same thing but also cannot prove it as it is fully unscriptural. The rapture is to the clouds only, not to heaven where God dwells. SDA gets many things right, but a good portion wrong and this is one of them.

 

[ewq1938]

14. We then have the 1000 Year Millennium as Christ takes the saints home to the Heavenly Kingdom and the New Jerusalem, and there we dwell for 1000 years, while Satan is bound to this desolate earth with no one to tempt.

No, he is bound and imprisoned in a pit in the Earth not to the surface of the Earth where he has always had access. The reason for the pit imprisonment is to keep him away from the nations which live on the Earth. When he is released FROM THE PIT, he goes to the people who are still there on the Earth as they always have been (no they are not the dead resurrected). They die the first death as mortals at Jerusalem and only after that are they resurrected for judgment and to die a second time. SDA has the order out of whack on these things.

 

[ewq1938]

I can see that compatible with a preterist view of Revelation or a Church History view of Revelation. But, that timing cannot be compatible with the Futurist view. The literalist/futurist suddenly reach for the figurative and symbolic to justify their silly notions. For centuries men have been date setters and proven to be frauds. The same is true today.

Errant date setting also is true for Preterists. None of the major end times events like the OD or parts of Rev have happened yet.

 

[Hobie]

Revelation 20:4

"I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands."

One is either beheaded without the mark, or have a head with the mark.

Those who got the victory were removed prior to the point the mark was given. Which by the way happens when God removes one's name from the Lamb's book of life. Those sealed were removed and waiting on the sea of glass. That sea of glass is not a place on earth.

Of course all those with the mark were destroyed in Revelation 19. No one is left in Adam's dead corruptible flesh. All are killed or tossed into the LOF.

The goats were tossed into the LOF. Matthew 25

"Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:"

"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment:"

That is the LOF. Even death and sheol will be cast into everlasting fire, everlasting punishment, the LOF.

Even the tares are gathered and cast into the LOF. Matthew 13:40-42

"As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."

These all are gathered before even the mark itself is placed on humanity by God, after the final harvest.

Those beheaded and those with the mark are the very last thousands if not millions left on earth after the final harvest. The goats are removed during the first 6 Trumpets. The tares are removed during the 7 Thunders. Those 13 judgments are the time of the final harvest. Both Jesus and His angels will be on earth removing both the redeemed and the unrighteous. Those with the mark and those beheaded are just the gleanings left over from the main harvest. That final 8th mystery Babylonian Empire will not be that spectacular.

Not all who died in Christ had their heads taken off, it just means died.

 

[Arthur81]

Not all who died in Christ had their heads taken off, it just means died.

You cannot re-write the Bible to suit your theology! All the standard translations specifically say "beheaded", which means they were martyrs, executed for their faith. If it merely meant "died in Christ" it would have been written that way. Funny how literalists leave their literalism when it contradicts their man-made system.

 

[Timtofly]

Not all who died in Christ had their heads taken off, it just means died.

Those in Christ are not even on the earth during those 42 months of Abomination of Desolation. The only two ambassadors of Christ are 2 individual witnesses, who go around killing people, for the Testimony of Jesus Christ. This is not the church age. There is no Holy Spirit at work during those 42 months. Satan is literally 100% in control and all that is done by all humanity is pure wickedness. The only redeemed are those dead who chopped their heads of in order to be redeemed. That was their profession of faith. Those who are not beheaded will receive the mark and be removed from the Lamb's book of life.

"And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.... And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed. These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will. And when they shall have finished."

This is not a spiritual battle. This is the point where names are being blotted out of the Lamb's book of life, and only those who die (willing to give up their sinful flesh), will live. Those who live will be marked, and placed in the LOF. Satan wants all to take the mark. Satan does not want any to be beheaded, because then they will be redeemed. When has Satan wanted mankind to be redeemed? There is no verse in the whole book of Revelation explicit nor implying Satan goes around beheading people as martyrs, nor killing them as martyrs by any method. There is in chapter 13, the point Satan can kill any who do not worship, but that could be any one, not just those who have "faith".

"which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands;"

All these conditions have to be met. People who refuse to worship, who take the mark so they don't starve to death, can still be killed with the mark, for refusing to worship. Satan can still kill those with the mark, as they end up in the LOF any way.

"And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name."

Nothing about being killed for not taking the mark. Only that they could not participate in the world economy unless they have the mark. Humans throughout history were marked by God, good or bad. Why would this mark be any different? I think if the mark was seen as something given by God as a curse, we would understand why Satan would reward those cursed by God, letting them participate in his economy. Worship on the other hand is demanded by Satan with or without having a mark. That is why one must give up this physical life to avoid the mark. It is a decision between each individual and God. Being beheaded is their testimony of faith in Jesus Christ.

The mark is the result of time being declared over at the 7th Trumpet. It seems it is an expiration stamp declaring God's redemption is over and they have been removed from the Lamb's book of life. That is why there are no redeemed alive on the earth except the two witnesses. Time has been declared up, and those 42 months only given so a few more souls can be harvested by being beheaded. The last of those slain per:

"until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled."

Those last beheaded souls literally slain out of Adam's dead corruptible flesh. They tasted death, then stood in judgment, and then obtained the first resurrection.

 

[Hobie]

Those in Christ are not even on the earth during those 42 months of Abomination of Desolation. The only two ambassadors of Christ are 2 individual witnesses, who go around killing people, for the Testimony of Jesus Christ. This is not the church age. There is no Holy Spirit at work during those 42 months. Satan is literally 100% in control and all that is done by all humanity is pure wickedness. The only redeemed are those dead who chopped their heads of in order to be redeemed. That was their profession of faith. Those who are not beheaded will receive the mark and be removed from the Lamb's book of life.

"And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.... And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed. These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will. And when they shall have finished."

This is not a spiritual battle. This is the point where names are being blotted out of the Lamb's book of life, and only those who die (willing to give up their sinful flesh), will live. Those who live will be marked, and placed in the LOF. Satan wants all to take the mark. Satan does not want any to be beheaded, because then they will be redeemed. When has Satan wanted mankind to be redeemed? There is no verse in the whole book of Revelation explicit nor implying Satan goes around beheading people as martyrs, nor killing them as martyrs by any method. There is in chapter 13, the point Satan can kill any who do not worship, but that could be any one, not just those who have "faith".

"which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands;"

All these conditions have to be met. People who refuse to worship, who take the mark so they don't starve to death, can still be killed with the mark, for refusing to worship. Satan can still kill those with the mark, as they end up in the LOF any way.

"And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name."

Nothing about being killed for not taking the mark. Only that they could not participate in the world economy unless they have the mark. Humans throughout history were marked by God, good or bad. Why would this mark be any different? I think if the mark was seen as something given by God as a curse, we would understand why Satan would reward those cursed by God, letting them participate in his economy. Worship on the other hand is demanded by Satan with or without having a mark. That is why one must give up this physical life to avoid the mark. It is a decision between each individual and God. Being beheaded is their testimony of faith in Jesus Christ.

The mark is the result of time being declared over at the 7th Trumpet. It seems it is an expiration stamp declaring God's redemption is over and they have been removed from the Lamb's book of life. That is why there are no redeemed alive on the earth except the two witnesses. Time has been declared up, and those 42 months only given so a few more souls can be harvested by being beheaded. The last of those slain per:

"until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled."

Those last beheaded souls literally slain out of Adam's dead corruptible flesh. They tasted death, then stood in judgment, and then obtained the first resurrection.

Well, lets take a look at this more closely..
Revelation 11:3-4
3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

The symbolism of the two olive trees and lampstands of candlesticks is also in the book of Zechariah.

Zechariah 4:1-14
1 And the angel that talked with me came again, and waked me, as a man that is wakened out of his sleep.
2 And said unto me, What seest thou? And I said, I have looked, and behold a candlestick all of gold, with a bowl upon the top of it, and his seven lamps thereon, and seven pipes to the seven lamps, which are upon the top thereof:
3 And two olive trees by it, one upon the right side of the bowl, and the other upon the left side thereof.
4 So I answered and spake to the angel that talked with me, saying, What are these, my lord?
5 Then the angel that talked with me answered and said unto me, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
6 Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the Lord unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the Lord of hosts.
7 Who art thou, O great mountain? before Zerubbabel thou shalt become a plain: and he shall bring forth the headstone thereof with shoutings, crying, Grace, grace unto it.
8 Moreover the word of the Lord came unto me, saying,
9 The hands of Zerubbabel have laid the foundation of this house; his hands shall also finish it; and thou shalt know that the Lord of hosts hath sent me unto you.
10 For who hath despised the day of small things? for they shall rejoice, and shall see the plummet in the hand of Zerubbabel with those seven; they are the eyes of the Lord, which run to and fro through the whole earth.
11 Then answered I, and said unto him, What are these two olive trees upon the right side of the candlestick and upon the left side thereof?
12 And I answered again, and said unto him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves?
13 And he answered me and said, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
14 Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth.

We see what John says of the lampstand of candlesticks
Revelation 1:20
The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.

This makes it apparent that a lampstand in bible symbolism is used to represent a church. The church representing a lampstand converts the olive oil it receives into light or understanding which guides the members of the church. So we have the candlesticks which are churches and what are the witnesses, the two witnesses represent the Old and New Testament Scriptures.

 

[Timtofly]

Well, lets take a look at this more closely..
Revelation 11:3-4
3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

The symbolism of the two olive trees and lampstands of candlesticks is also in the book of Zechariah.

Zechariah 4:1-14
1 And the angel that talked with me came again, and waked me, as a man that is wakened out of his sleep.
2 And said unto me, What seest thou? And I said, I have looked, and behold a candlestick all of gold, with a bowl upon the top of it, and his seven lamps thereon, and seven pipes to the seven lamps, which are upon the top thereof:
3 And two olive trees by it, one upon the right side of the bowl, and the other upon the left side thereof.
4 So I answered and spake to the angel that talked with me, saying, What are these, my lord?
5 Then the angel that talked with me answered and said unto me, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
6 Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the Lord unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the Lord of hosts.
7 Who art thou, O great mountain? before Zerubbabel thou shalt become a plain: and he shall bring forth the headstone thereof with shoutings, crying, Grace, grace unto it.
8 Moreover the word of the Lord came unto me, saying,
9 The hands of Zerubbabel have laid the foundation of this house; his hands shall also finish it; and thou shalt know that the Lord of hosts hath sent me unto you.
10 For who hath despised the day of small things? for they shall rejoice, and shall see the plummet in the hand of Zerubbabel with those seven; they are the eyes of the Lord, which run to and fro through the whole earth.
11 Then answered I, and said unto him, What are these two olive trees upon the right side of the candlestick and upon the left side thereof?
12 And I answered again, and said unto him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves?
13 And he answered me and said, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
14 Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth.

We see what John says of the lampstand of candlesticks
Revelation 1:20
The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.

This makes it apparent that a lampstand in bible symbolism is used to represent a church. The church representing a lampstand converts the olive oil it receives into light or understanding which guides the members of the church. So we have the candlesticks which are churches and what are the witnesses, the two witnesses represent the Old and New Testament Scriptures.

Jesus was a single person, yet represented the church. Did all the church redeem mankind?

7 churches were individual locations on a map. Is the entire church only in those single locations?

Perhaps God's uses individuals at times, and God does not expect us to claim the entire church is being represented, as those individuals. They individually represent God's church on the earth.

 

[ewq1938]

So we have the candlesticks which are churches and what are the witnesses, the two witnesses represent the Old and New Testament Scriptures.

That is not what scripture says though. The two witnesses are TWO candlesticks (which you already showed are churches. That alone disproves your conclusion that the two witnesses are the OT and NT because one witness is two churches. That makes it impossible for the two to be two churches, the OT and the NT. The other one of the 2W are olive trees and those are anointed people (prophets) that comes from the OT which you also showed so:

The two witnesses are TWO CHURCHES and TWO ANOINTED PEOPLE (I believe this makes them prophets which is why Rev 11 speaks of two prophets being killed and resurrecting)

There is nothing in Rev 11 to support the 2W being the OT and NT and that conflicts with the language used.