When did Daniel 7:13-14 happen?

Taken said:

Either one IS SAVED, QUICKENED....Immune to committing Sin...Free from Committing Sin...Kept from committing sin BY the POWER of God “IN” them...
Or they Are not.
Salvation, Quickening, Gods Power IN a man...is not kinda, sorta.
It IS, or It ISN’T.

Click to expand...

ONLY by the shed Blood of Christ are we made to be "sin-less" before the Father.
Col. 3[3] For ye are dead, and your life is hid** with Christ in God.

The only time that any Born Again Christian will ever be "sin-free", is when we are redeemed into Christ's likeness of HIS immortality, upon His final coming, in all His visible Glory.

**Note: Strongs- G2928- Hid- a covering; covered.

Taken replied:
"Snarky. Not particularly advantageous to begin with such a comment, with expectation the person going forward is going to be focused on the point you really are trying to make."

Earburner's reply: You are coming across as being flustered and abrasive. So, not at the beginning of my words, but at the end: its OK to remain calm.

Taken said:

I am not forgetting anything.
Already am aware and addressed, people getting their water dip, without a clue of the all encompassing big picture.

Click to expand...

Ok, so WHY is it that people are allowed to join church membership, being only "half baked"??
Ans. Both the Pastors (church leaders) and the congregations are only teaching/learning half of the Gospel message, still holding onto their original "boarding pass" to eternal destruction.

Many love to hear about the historical Jesus, but only few love to KNOW Of the Spiritual Jesus.

Taken said:

I would presume...B-cuz water dip “certification” is the basic requirement for joining “being” considered a member of a church.

There is not a “test” of “knowledge” or “understanding”.
(Kind of like becoming a sitting gov rep......no test, scant qualification...)

Click to expand...

How about a personal testimony of how one came to be repentant, knowing that they need the Lord as their Savior? Would that be be sufficient enough to constitute one as a bonafide believer?
From that point, if they have not yet asked for or recieved His Holy Spirit, they should be led to do so, with a solid study about Pentecost, being instructed also by
Revelation 3:20
Luke 11:13
Romans 8:8-9
From their, they will then appreciate the symbou

^ continued- symbolism of water babtism.

Marty fox said:

But you are denying the words right out of Jesus' mouth because of when you think something happened which many think is in the future and many like me think it was in the past.

What Jesus says is fact so when did Jesus say that He received His authority in heaven and on earth?

Matthew 28:18-20
18 Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

When He ascended back to heaven

Click to expand...

So you believe jesus has been reigning as king over earth for close to 2,000 years now? Show me where it says Jesus would let this unspeakable evil to continue unabated like this.

Why is Satan called the god of this world by Paul? shouldn't He know that he was evicted?

I see in the bible Jesus returning physically to earth and establishing the Kingdom on earth, and He has not done that yet. being given authority does not mean He has taken rule yet on earth, for he hasn't!

Revelation 12:10
King James Version

10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

The word in Matt. 28:18 is exousia which is: The KJV translates Strong's G1849 in the following manner: power (69x), authority (29x), right (2x), liberty (1x), jurisdiction (1x), strength (1x).

and the verb "is given" is in the aorist, which simply speaks of an action without regard to time. If this was the only passage cocnering the kingdom of Jesus, yours would be a powerful argument. But because we have many passages delineating the time frame when Jesus begins to rule- we know that though He has been given the right to rule, He has not begun to rule. Currently Jesus is not regining as King, but is living to make intercession for the saints. Jesus is still i His role as Great High Priest.

Taken said:

Heaven is never called eternal.
God is called eternal, expressly without beginning.

Click to expand...

Never called tempral either. but God exists in a place (whether material or immaterial) before creation there was no matter, so heaven is unlike the created universe with its two heavens.

Ronald Nolette said:

So you believe jesus has been reigning as king over earth for close to 2,000 years now? Show me where it says Jesus would let this unspeakable evil to continue unabated like this.

Why is Satan called the god of this world by Paul? shouldn't He know that he was evicted?

I see in the bible Jesus returning physically to earth and establishing the Kingdom on earth, and He has not done that yet. being given authority does not mean He has taken rule yet on earth, for he hasn't!

Revelation 12:10
King James Version

10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

The word in Matt. 28:18 is exousia which is: The KJV translates Strong's G1849 in the following manner: power (69x), authority (29x), right (2x), liberty (1x), jurisdiction (1x), strength (1x).

and the verb "is given" is in the aorist, which simply speaks of an action without regard to time. If this was the only passage cocnering the kingdom of Jesus, yours would be a powerful argument. But because we have many passages delineating the time frame when Jesus begins to rule- we know that though He has been given the right to rule, He has not begun to rule. Currently Jesus is not regining as King, but is living to make intercession for the saints. Jesus is still i His role as Great High Priest.

Click to expand...

I have to agree with that, since you kept to the actual Bible about that.

Taken said:

I would prefer...Converted. Same language Jesus used, that leaves no question.

Click to expand...

Yeah! Converted into a new creature in Christ Jesus, and not the old creature remodeled.
Only born again Christians comprehend that, as being a genuine reality of our own life being made dead, and that it is Jesus who is Living His New Life in us and through us.
And of course, that is what His second coming, by His Spirit taking up residence within us, is all about.
That being done and sealed by his Holy Spirit, we are now ready for whenever His final and Glorious appearance shall be.

He alone IS the first resurrection, and all Born again Christians "hath part" (who are partakers** of it), ARE blessed and holy, having no fear of the second death.
Revelation 20:6

** Note: 2 Peter 1:4

Marty fox said:

Daniel 7:13-14
13 “In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. 14 He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all nations and peoples of every language worshiped him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.

Some Christians think that this is in our future but I believe that the bible shows us that it happened on the day of Jesus accention and it was the same time as Revelation 12:5-10

Click to expand...

Daniel 7:v.7 to 14
verse 7 >>>After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns.<<<

As you and all know, the prophecy is revealing about the fourth Empire - the dreadful and terrible, and strong Roman Empire - diverse from the Greek, Persian and Babylonian kingdoms that were before it. As you and all know, the Roman Empire was specifically and genuinely a Gentile Empire, but there was also a completely alien being or nation in the Gentile Roman Empire: It was Israel. For this reason the prophecy reveals this appendix linked to the Roman Empire as 10 other independent powers, descendants of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, prophetically represented by 10 horns. (Judah is another Kingdom separated from the nation or KINGDOM of Israel, and is not accounted in this prophecy). By the way, in Daniel 2, Israel (Israel is the clay-Isaiah 64:v.8) is represented by 10 toes of the feet of the Nebuchadnezzar's estatue.

verse 8 >>> I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.<<<
The prophecy now is focusing the ten horns.
We know by prophecy that they represent Israel, descendants from Abraham among the Gentile nations, ruled by the Roman Empire, but from the midst of the 10 horns will rise up another very peculiar and little individual horn, but very powerful with his eyes (satanic vision) and a mouth speaking great things (blasphemy). I'm not sure how the little horn(the eleventh horn) will pluck up 3 horns from the first 10 horns by the roots, it seems he will erase them, maybe will be the tribe of Levy, Judah and Benjamin, staying only 7 tribes: Reuben, Gad, Aser, Nephthalin, Simeon, Issachar and Dan that is not accounted in Revelation 7, replaced by Joseph; By the way, the little horn may be of the tribe of Dan, as prophesied Jacob:Genesis 49:v.16-17 - Dan shall be a serpent by the way, an adder in the path, that biteth the horse heels, so that his rider shall fall backward. Dan shall judge his people, as one of the tribes of Israel.

The little horn is the Man Beast like a lamb having two horns (a false lamb, course), actually a false messiah, an esoteric, kabbalistic and spiritist messiah (John 5:v.43 to 47 combined with 2 Thessalonians 2: 4and9-12), and he speaks as Dragon-Revelation 13:v.11-18. He will be enthroned in Jerusalém the holy city, called spiritually Sodom and Egypt, and he will rule Israel in the last week Daniel 9:v.27, and also will be main guide of the esoteric, kabbalistic and SPIRITIST Judaism.

verses 9-10-11 >>> 9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.
10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before Him: thousand thousands ministered unto Him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before Him: the Judgment was set, and the books were opened.
11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.<<<

We are still analyzing and speaking of the prophecy within of the environment of Roman Empire from 146 B.C. until the current time. Two thousand years ago the Word was made flesh and JESUS was born, it was the fourth Day-Genesis 1v.16 combined with John 5:v.17- and a new Era started by the preaching of the Gospel of GOD's kingdom by/through JESUS, and after by His apostles and disciples until today.
Now see,"our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto His glorious body,according to the working whereby He is able even to subdue all things unto himself"-Phi.3:20-21, but the red Dragon, Satan, our Enemy, he also is in heaven,I mean he is in the same spiritual environment we are-Revelation 12:v.3-4- he was already Judged by our LORD and now will be Judged his world as a whole, he will be cast down from this celestial environment to the earth, but it by fight, by a War. For the Judgment of the Devil's world already there are Thrones according the Word of GOD, and one specific and special Throne for the Ancient of days like the fiery flame. The red Dragon - Satan - will be furious, John heard the voice of the great words which the horn-the false messiah of the Jews-spake-verse 11 above:

Now, even now, from now on, the Judgment of all nations will be established according is written in the books, from Genesis to Revelation. Do you know what will be the consequences of GOD's wrath upon the Earth in the current time?

- the devilish nations will be angry, they will be furious because the WRATH of GOD that will fall upon them all - Revelation 11:v.18

- GOD will destroy them which destroy the earth - Revelation 11:v.18

- one of the 7 heads of the main partnership of the red Dragon, whose partner has 7 heads, and 10 horns, and upon his 7 heads a name of blasphemy -Revelation 13:v.1-, yeah, one of the 7 heads will be wounded to death, in fact a mortal wound. Then the esoteric and kabbalistic, and spiritist false messiah, the Man Beast like a lamb-Revelation 13:v.11- will give to his main partnership his Power, and his Throne in Jerusalem, and great Authority, and the wounded head of the FIRST Beast will be healed.

- the court which is without the temple...it will be given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months-Revelation 11:v.2.

- and the false messiah will exercise all the power of the FIRST Man Beast before him, and will cause the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the FIRST Man Beast, whose deadly wound was healed.(by the false messiah, course)-Rev.13:v.12

- and the false messiah will do great wonders,so that he will make fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men-Rev.13:v.13.

- and will deceive them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the FIRST Beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the Man Beast, which had the wound by a Sword-the Word of GOD-and did live - Rev.13:v.14.

In LITERAL fulfillment of the verses above many many indescribable things will happen in whole earth from now on, course, it because the Ancient days is already seated on His throne, and the Judgment is now given to the saints of the Most High; and the time came that the saints will possess the kingdom according Revelation 11:v.15 to 18.

VERSE >>>13 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven(CLOUDS? Psalm 97: v.2and 1), and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.<<<
The one like the Son of man is Michael, who was seen by Daniel moving towards the person of JESUS, and the Judgment shall sit, and the saints of the Most High shall take away the dominio of Satan here in the Earth, to consume and to destroy it unto the end. And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

Revelation 11:v. 15 - will fulfill LITERALLY from now on. The kingdoms OF THIS WORLD (the satanic world of Devil) are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. JESUS will return after the victory of Michael against Satan and his angels-Revelation 12: v.7 to 17

JESUS-the Ancient of days- said: All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

verse >>>14 And (by JESUS) will be given to Michael dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.<<<

DANIEL PROPHESIED:

continues in next post, below

DANIEL PROPHESIED:
continuation of above post

And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever. Daniel 12:v.1-3

THERE WILL BE AN INDESCRIBABLE RESURRECTION IN THE DAYS TO COME OR IN THE CURRENT TIME
1 Thessalonians 4:v.13 to 16
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with Him. Hallelujah!!!
15 For this we say unto you by the Word of the Lord -the Word is GOD-, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice(message) of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:- literal fulfillment of Daniel 12:v.2
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the CLOUDS(CLOUDS? Psalm 97:v.2 and 1. Righteous Judgment, yes, Judgment), to meet the Lord in the AIR(AIR? air is heaven: here the 3rd heaven-God's Kingdom-) and so shall we ever be with the Lord. AMEN.

Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh(FIRST WILL COME MICHAEL), shall he find faith on the earth? Luke 18:v.8

Oseas said:

DANIEL PROPHESIED:
continuation of above post

And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever. Daniel 12:v.1-3

THERE WILL BE AN INDESCRIBABLE RESURRECTION IN THE DAYS TO COME OR IN THE CURRENT TIME
1 Thessalonians 4:v.13 to 16
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with Him. Hallelujah!!!
15 For this we say unto you by the Word of the Lord -the Word is GOD-, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice(message) of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:- literal fulfillment of Daniel 12:v.2
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the CLOUDS(CLOUDS? Psalm 97:v.2 and 1. Righteous Judgment, yes, Judgment), to meet the Lord in the AIR(AIR? air is heaven: here the 3rd heaven-God's Kingdom-) and so shall we ever be with the Lord. AMEN.

Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh(FIRST WILL COME MICHAEL), shall he find faith on the earth? Luke 18:v.8

Click to expand...

Hi Oseas, it appears that you are a serious student of God's words, and you have put alot of mental effort into it, as to what you have shown here. In it, you have all the players and pieces on the table, and a few more that I have not been able to relate to.

As far as the positioning of them all, I am finding that your assembling of the grand picture of things is not shaping up to much of what I have on my own table, or that of what others have assembled on theirs.
Not to worry though, God will continue to guide you through it, as you trust in Him.

I have often applied the analogy of our studies of the Bible with that of assembling the pieces of a large "picture puzzle". Some pieces fit perfectly fine, but for others, I would have to go back and rearrange them, because I was trying to force fit the piece(s), and/or the partial picture it revealed, didn't display anything relative or recognizable.
However, having said that, one thing we all have in common is, none of us have seen the completed picture on the box, of what the puzzle should look like.

Keep at it, and above all, let God's Holy Spirit and the following scriptures be your guide:
Proverbs 3:5
Isaiah 55:8-9
Zechariah 4:6
John 16:13

May God Bless you in your walk with Him,
Earburner

Taken said:

Not going to debate before creation...

Two heavens ?
2 Cor 12:
[2] I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth such an one caught up to the third heaven.

Click to expand...

Speaking of heavens.

Genesis 1:v.1 - In the beginning ( in JESUS ) God created the heavens and the earth. (four heavens)

Yes, you said what GOD says by His Word about third heaven. This is very very important. The Word is GOD.

Deuteronomy 10:v.14 (among other Scriptures) says: 14 Behold, the heaven and the heaven of heavens is the Lord's thy God, the earth also, with all that therein is.

Speaking in heavens, you mentioned the third heaven, then there are also the 1st and the 2nd heavens, besides the heaven of the heavens.

In what heaven we the Christian people are living in the current time? You, we, know that Ephesians 1:v. 3 says: 3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heaven(ly) places in Christ. Furthermore, Philippians 3:v.20-21 say: "
20 For our conversation is in heaven (what heaven???); from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:
21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

Interpreting what is heaven by the Word of GOD - the Word is GOD - I see that the havens were/are planted by our GOD here in the earth by His revealed Word. GOD said by the prophet Isaiah about the captive exile: Isaiah 51:v.16 - And I -GOD- have put my words in thy mouth, and I have covered thee in the shadow of mine hand, that I -GOD- may plant the heavens, and lay the foundations of the earth, and say unto Zion, Thou art my people.

That said, based in the Word of GOD-the Word is GOD- GOD planted the FIRST heaven by Moses. GOD put His words in the mouth of Moses;
Hebrews 9:v.19-24:
19 For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people,

20 Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.

21 Moreover he sprinkled with blood both the tabernacle, and all the vessels of the ministry.

22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.

23 It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens (the first and the second heavens, planted respectively by/through the mouth of Moses (OT-first heaven) and mouth of JESUS-the NT-2nd heaven) should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these.

24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of GOD for us:

The third heaven is the next to be established: Revelation 11:v.15to18 combined with Luke 20:v.35-36, among others. The third heaven is the next to be established and will only last 1,000 years. After the final battle against Satan and his demonic world at the end of this seventh and millennium, or third heaven period, then the heaven of heavens will be established and with it the Eternity.

May the Lord keep us with Him forever and ever. Amen

P.S.

Isaiah 40:v. 21-22
21 Have ye not known? have ye not heard? hath it not been told you from the beginning? have ye not understood from the foundations of the earth?

22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain (the heavens which GOD has planted here as above commented), and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:

Marty fox said:

Jesus reign is spiritual as God is spiritual and God is sovereign and reigns over all and Jesus spirit resides in us think like God not man

Click to expand...

Jesus reign will be physical and on planet earth!

Marty fox said:

For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.

We reign in life now

Click to expand...

But we are not kings

Marty fox said:

Jesus is the ruler now

Click to expand...

that is not what Scriptures says. It says in 2 Cor. 4:4 satan is still the god of this world. And in ephesians 6 it shows we wrestle against a hierarchy of evil authorities!

Marty fox said:

God also is in control of everything and nothing happens without Him allowing it to
thus He still allows sin

Click to expand...

Yes He does! and He still allows satan temporary rulership of this earth. Remember earth was forfeited to Satan after the fall. satan still rules this world:

Luke 4
King James Version

4 And Jesus being full of the Holy Ghost returned from Jordan, and was led by the Spirit into the wilderness,

2 Being forty days tempted of the devil. And in those days he did eat nothing: and when they were ended, he afterward hungered.

3 And the devil said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, command this stone that it be made bread.

4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God.

5 And the devil, taking him up into an high mountain, shewed unto him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time.

6 And the devil said unto him, All this power will I give thee, and the glory of them: for that is delivered unto me; and to whomsoever I will I give it.

7 If thou therefore wilt worship me, all shall be thine.

Satan will give them to his son the antichrist in the tribulation period. then when Jesus returns He takes them back

Taken said:

Not going to debate before creation...

Two heavens ?
2 Cor 12:
[2] I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth such an one caught up to the third heaven.

Click to expand...

Well if you read my posts you would have know I said there are 3 heavens mentioned in the bible: the atmosphere is #1, OUter space is #2 and the throne of God or new Jerusalem is #3.