Here is an email I received from someone I know very well. They think that the religious people who are left behind will have the biggest role in convincing the world that the event that took millions of people in the twinkling of an eye was NOT the Rapture.This person had what they feel is sort of an epiphany as to what will happen after the Rapture to convince people that the event they witnessed was not the calling up of the Christians before the Tribulation. Yes, I realize there are people here who don't believe in the pre-Tribulation Rapture. I got that.A discussion as to exactly what point in the end of times it will take place is not what I am looking for.I would simply like your opinion on what the person said, based on the idea of a pre-Tribulation Rapture. Thanks..."I wondered passively for a couple of years how those left behind after the Rapture were going to be conned into believing that the Rapture actually did not take place. How would the powers in place be able to discredit and explain away the sudden disappearance of tens of millions if not hundreds of millions of people around the world. Especially when most of those who disappear will have been known to their family, co-workers and community in general as Christians. With the popularity of the “Left Behind” series and the fact that very few Americans, both Christian and non-Christian have never heard about the Rapture in one form or another, how will those who remain behind discredit it?Since the event itself is a given and I know I will not be on earth to witness the aftermath, I had not given it much thought. But recently, after listening to a discussion between two people who seemed to think that something important hinged on the answer, I began to actually ponder it.After a couple of days of thinking and discussing with others, I realized the answer was incredibly simple.It will be the testimony of the millions and millions of those who called (and even considered) themselves Christians but didn’t really “walk the walk.” I know that sounds cold and judgmental, but I believe it to be accurate, none the less. Those of faith stating that the event couldn’t have really been the Rapture will likely fall into a couple of groups:First are the Christian and other “God-centric” faiths that claim, doctrinally or otherwise, that the Rapture is not a real event but rather a legend or false teaching of a “fringe element” within the true Christian faith. They will acknowledge that what took place was a world-changing, possibly supernatural event, “but it was not the so-called Rapture.” They will say that their continued presence here proves it. The next group will be those who believe in the Rapture, but genuinely believe that since they are still here, living what they believe in their hearts is a Christ-based life, this event could not possibly have been it. They will also state that while this was event was world-changing and possibly even supernatural, it was not the Rapture. Another group will be those who, either immediately or upon reflection, will realize that it was indeed the Rapture and they did in fact “miss the boat.” However they likely won’t be strong enough in Christ to admit publically that their living in continued sin caused them to be left behind. (Especially if they are knowledgeable enough to know what is going to happen to Christians over the coming years and are not strong enough to risk the very real chance of torture and martyrdom.) And yes, there will be people who realized they “missed the boat” and will then become zealous Christians, come what may.The last group with be the people who have used the banner of Christianity to cover their lifestyle. Churches or religious organizations that never really were Christian (and themselves knew it) but used the moniker to try to bring mainstream acceptance and tolerance of their ungodly lifestyle or practices. They will either deny the Rapture, again stating that their continued presence is proof of that fallacy, or they will openly state that the “restrictive, oppressive sect of followers” has been taken away, possibly to be punished, and that the people still here are better off for it. The governmental powers will plea for peace and patience during this time, looking to those religious figures still here for help. When questioned, those religious “leaders” will state that it was not the Rapture and the fact that they are still here proves it. And people will listen. Even if they doubt, they will listen. They will want what they are being told to be true. They will look to these people to pray for them, explain why their loved ones are gone, and give them some peace of mind in what will obviously be a great upheaval.My curiosity now goes to what will be the actual “explanation” they provide to explain away the disappearance of so many people at the same instant. "
How The World Will Be Convinced The Rapture Didn't Happen.
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Here is an email I received from someone I know very well. QUOTE
They think that the religious people who are left behind will have the biggest role in convincing the world that the event that took millions of people in the twinkling of an eye was NOT the Rapture.This person had what they feel is sort of an epiphany as to what will happen after the Rapture to convince people that the event they witnessed was not the calling up of the Christians before the Tribulation. Yes, I realize there are people here who don't believe in the pre-Tribulation Rapture. I got that.A discussion as to exactly what point in the end of times it will take place is not what I am looking for.I would simply like your opinion on what the person said, based on the idea of a pre-Tribulation Rapture. Thanks...
The twinkling of an eye is in reference to all being changed,not a rapture.That event will happen to all,not just Christians.It's not a matter of what point in time this will happen,the point is our gathering back to Christ,and when that happens,nobody is going anywhere as Christ will be here.
They think that the religious people who are left behind will have the biggest role in convincing the world that the event that took millions of people in the twinkling of an eye was NOT the Rapture.This person had what they feel is sort of an epiphany as to what will happen after the Rapture to convince people that the event they witnessed was not the calling up of the Christians before the Tribulation. Yes, I realize there are people here who don't believe in the pre-Tribulation Rapture. I got that.A discussion as to exactly what point in the end of times it will take place is not what I am looking for.I would simply like your opinion on what the person said, based on the idea of a pre-Tribulation Rapture. Thanks...
The twinkling of an eye is in reference to all being changed,not a rapture.That event will happen to all,not just Christians.It's not a matter of what point in time this will happen,the point is our gathering back to Christ,and when that happens,nobody is going anywhere as Christ will be here.
QUOTE (Polar @ Apr 23 2009, 11:13 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=72919
Here is an email I received from someone I know very well. They think that the religious people who are left behind will have the biggest role in convincing the world that the event that took millions of people in the twinkling of an eye was NOT the Rapture.This person had what they feel is sort of an epiphany as to what will happen after the Rapture to convince people that the event they witnessed was not the calling up of the Christians before the Tribulation. My curiosity now goes to what will be the actual “explanation” they provide to explain away the disappearance of so many people at the same instant. "
Our time is short for the end is coming upon us quickly. The prophecies of the End of this Age will come to fulfillment at the appointed time Daniel 11:27 last part. We are NOT given the day or the hour, but we are given these events which tells us when it comes. Daniel 12:1-2 Michael the great prince who protects your people, will arise. There will be a time of distress such as has not happened from the beginning of nations until then. But at that time your people whose name is found written in the Book will be delivered. God tells us that a time of distress comes first that is so bad, nothing like it has ever happened on the earth before, Dan. 12:7 says it wll be for a time, times and a half time which is 1260 days or 3 1/2 yrs. Distress that the earth has never known. If your thinking you are taken out of this, these verses show us, NO ONE IS RESURRECTED TILL THIS IS COMPLETED. Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will AWAKE; some to ever lasting life, others to shame and everlasting CONTEMPT. God raises the unjust with the just at the resurrection of the dead at his coming just as the verse says in Daniel 12:2. The fire coming down from heaven will consume the enemies of God when we are put into our rooms as his wrath passes over. Isa 26:19-20.
Here is an email I received from someone I know very well. They think that the religious people who are left behind will have the biggest role in convincing the world that the event that took millions of people in the twinkling of an eye was NOT the Rapture.This person had what they feel is sort of an epiphany as to what will happen after the Rapture to convince people that the event they witnessed was not the calling up of the Christians before the Tribulation. My curiosity now goes to what will be the actual “explanation” they provide to explain away the disappearance of so many people at the same instant. "
Our time is short for the end is coming upon us quickly. The prophecies of the End of this Age will come to fulfillment at the appointed time Daniel 11:27 last part. We are NOT given the day or the hour, but we are given these events which tells us when it comes. Daniel 12:1-2 Michael the great prince who protects your people, will arise. There will be a time of distress such as has not happened from the beginning of nations until then. But at that time your people whose name is found written in the Book will be delivered. God tells us that a time of distress comes first that is so bad, nothing like it has ever happened on the earth before, Dan. 12:7 says it wll be for a time, times and a half time which is 1260 days or 3 1/2 yrs. Distress that the earth has never known. If your thinking you are taken out of this, these verses show us, NO ONE IS RESURRECTED TILL THIS IS COMPLETED. Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will AWAKE; some to ever lasting life, others to shame and everlasting CONTEMPT. God raises the unjust with the just at the resurrection of the dead at his coming just as the verse says in Daniel 12:2. The fire coming down from heaven will consume the enemies of God when we are put into our rooms as his wrath passes over. Isa 26:19-20.
When the church is removed I think it will be a wakeup call for the people who are familiar with Christianity but not yet saved. I think they will convert (probably quickly).They will have salvation but will not be "kept from the wrath that is to come". Thus the beheadings and martyrdom you see in Revelation. It will be decision time for all people. It will be extremely dangerous and unpopular to follow Christ during that time. Many rewards to those who do hold to the testimony of Jesus. More rewards than we "standard" Christians will receive anyway. Remember throughout this time the Angel is proclaiming the eternal gospel to the whole world and the 144,000 are hard at work. Of course the enemy and false prophets will be hard at work as well. Like I said , it will be decision time , no neutral zone here. When Jesus himself comes and stands on The Mount Of Olives , it is finally at that moment the unbeleivers see the errors of their ways. (Especially Israel)
QUOTE (Martin W. @ Apr 24 2009, 04:52 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=72953
When the church is removed I think it will be a wakeup call for the people who are familiar with Christianity but not yet saved. I think they will convert (probably quickly).They will have salvation but will not be "kept from the wrath that is to come". Thus the beheadings and martyrdom you see in Revelation. It will be decision time for all people. It will be extremely dangerous and unpopular to follow Christ during that time. Many rewards to those who do hold to the testimony of Jesus. More rewards than we "standard" Christians will receive anyway. Remember throughout this time the Angel is proclaiming the eternal gospel to the whole world and the 144,000 are hard at work. Of course the enemy and false prophets will be hard at work as well. Like I said , it will be decision time , no neutral zone here. When Jesus himself comes and stands on The Mount Of Olives , it is finally at that moment the unbeleivers see the errors of their ways. (Especially Israel)
Hi Martin, The ways that Daniel 12:1-2 comes across is that the distress is the greatest upon the earth ever, and then those whose name is found written in the Lamb's book of Life are brought fourth into eternal life, but there is also those who are raised at the same time to everlasting contempt. This tells me that there is more than we understand. The good and the bad who are dead are both resurrected at the same time, so why is there a need for anyone to preach if the wicked is raised with the good? Vickie
When the church is removed I think it will be a wakeup call for the people who are familiar with Christianity but not yet saved. I think they will convert (probably quickly).They will have salvation but will not be "kept from the wrath that is to come". Thus the beheadings and martyrdom you see in Revelation. It will be decision time for all people. It will be extremely dangerous and unpopular to follow Christ during that time. Many rewards to those who do hold to the testimony of Jesus. More rewards than we "standard" Christians will receive anyway. Remember throughout this time the Angel is proclaiming the eternal gospel to the whole world and the 144,000 are hard at work. Of course the enemy and false prophets will be hard at work as well. Like I said , it will be decision time , no neutral zone here. When Jesus himself comes and stands on The Mount Of Olives , it is finally at that moment the unbeleivers see the errors of their ways. (Especially Israel)
Hi Martin, The ways that Daniel 12:1-2 comes across is that the distress is the greatest upon the earth ever, and then those whose name is found written in the Lamb's book of Life are brought fourth into eternal life, but there is also those who are raised at the same time to everlasting contempt. This tells me that there is more than we understand. The good and the bad who are dead are both resurrected at the same time, so why is there a need for anyone to preach if the wicked is raised with the good? Vickie
It will be extremely dangerous and unpopular to follow Christ during that time.QUOTE
During this time people will believe that Christ is here,but is will be satan in his role as the antichrist2 Corinthians 11 13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. 14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. 15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works. Contrary to what many think,satan will not be going around killing people
During this time people will believe that Christ is here,but is will be satan in his role as the antichrist2 Corinthians 11 13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. 14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. 15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works. Contrary to what many think,satan will not be going around killing people
"Yes, I realize there are people here who don't believe in the pre-Tribulation Rapture. I got that.A discussion as to exactly what point in the end of times it will take place is not what I am looking for.I would simply like your opinion on what the person said, based on the idea of a pre-Tribulation Rapture." -- Yours Truly-- It would seem some who choose to post here either: A.) Did not to read post completely before commenting. -or- B.) Read the request and simply chose to ignore it. Either option is disappointing.
Hi Polar. Back to your original question which was .............. "My curiosity now goes to what will be the actual “explanation” they provide to explain away the disappearance of so many people at the same instant. "(Polar)I have actually given this a lot of thought through the years .... and do not know the answer , of course.Sometimes I do consider how un-popular Christianity is becoming in the world and they (the unsaved world) would rejoice if we were removed. They would see it as a cleansing. Any explaination would be fine with them.
QUOTE (Polar @ Apr 25 2009, 08:36 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=72993
"Yes, I realize there are people here who don't believe in the pre-Tribulation Rapture. I got that.A discussion as to exactly what point in the end of times it will take place is not what I am looking for.I would simply like your opinion on what the person said, based on the idea of a pre-Tribulation Rapture." -- Yours Truly
Here is some exact words of those who are left behind that God spoke to Jeremiah to write for us. It is pretty scary. Though it may surprise you to see that these were of the called and refused to walk up right before the LORD. Both O.T and N.T. Jeremiah 8:1-4 1 At that time, saith the LORD, they shall bring out the bones of the kings of Judah, and the bones of his princes, and the bones of the priests, and the bones of the prophets, and the bones of the inhabitants of Jerusalem, out of their graves: 2 And they shall spread them before the sun, and the moon, and all the host of heaven, whom they have loved, and whom they have served, and after whom they have walked, and whom they have sought, and whom they have worshipped: they shall not be gathered, nor be buried; they shall be for dung upon the face of the earth. 3 And death shall be chosen rather than life by all the residue of them that remain of this evil family, which remain in all the places whither I have driven them, saith the LORD of hosts. 13 I will surely consume them, saith the LORD: there shall be no grapes on the vine, nor figs on the fig tree, and the leaf shall fade; and the things that I have given them shall pass away from them. (here are the words from their mouths they are going to speak) 14 Why do we sit still? assemble yourselves, and let us enter into the defenced cities, and let us be silent there: for the LORD our God hath put us to silence, and given us water of gall to drink, because we have sinned against the LORD. 15 We looked for peace, but no good came; and for a time of health, and behold trouble! 20. The harvest is past, the summer is ended, and we are not saved. It is a very scary time that is coming upon the earth between man and God whom they have not served in the manner which the Lord has commanded. These people are those who were called and not chosen. Something to think about. The Narrow Door Luke 13:24 make every effort to enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to. Once the owner of the house get us and closes the door, you will stand outside knocking and pleading, "Sir, open the door for us" But he will answer, I don't know you or where you come from. Then you will say, We ate and drank with you, and you taught in our streets, but he will reply, "Get away from me you evil doers."There is effort we must make, overcoming the sin within us, we have a walk to perform and Christ will help us, but if we don't we are evil and not of his fold.
"Yes, I realize there are people here who don't believe in the pre-Tribulation Rapture. I got that.A discussion as to exactly what point in the end of times it will take place is not what I am looking for.I would simply like your opinion on what the person said, based on the idea of a pre-Tribulation Rapture." -- Yours Truly
Here is some exact words of those who are left behind that God spoke to Jeremiah to write for us. It is pretty scary. Though it may surprise you to see that these were of the called and refused to walk up right before the LORD. Both O.T and N.T. Jeremiah 8:1-4 1 At that time, saith the LORD, they shall bring out the bones of the kings of Judah, and the bones of his princes, and the bones of the priests, and the bones of the prophets, and the bones of the inhabitants of Jerusalem, out of their graves: 2 And they shall spread them before the sun, and the moon, and all the host of heaven, whom they have loved, and whom they have served, and after whom they have walked, and whom they have sought, and whom they have worshipped: they shall not be gathered, nor be buried; they shall be for dung upon the face of the earth. 3 And death shall be chosen rather than life by all the residue of them that remain of this evil family, which remain in all the places whither I have driven them, saith the LORD of hosts. 13 I will surely consume them, saith the LORD: there shall be no grapes on the vine, nor figs on the fig tree, and the leaf shall fade; and the things that I have given them shall pass away from them. (here are the words from their mouths they are going to speak) 14 Why do we sit still? assemble yourselves, and let us enter into the defenced cities, and let us be silent there: for the LORD our God hath put us to silence, and given us water of gall to drink, because we have sinned against the LORD. 15 We looked for peace, but no good came; and for a time of health, and behold trouble! 20. The harvest is past, the summer is ended, and we are not saved. It is a very scary time that is coming upon the earth between man and God whom they have not served in the manner which the Lord has commanded. These people are those who were called and not chosen. Something to think about. The Narrow Door Luke 13:24 make every effort to enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to. Once the owner of the house get us and closes the door, you will stand outside knocking and pleading, "Sir, open the door for us" But he will answer, I don't know you or where you come from. Then you will say, We ate and drank with you, and you taught in our streets, but he will reply, "Get away from me you evil doers."There is effort we must make, overcoming the sin within us, we have a walk to perform and Christ will help us, but if we don't we are evil and not of his fold.
I believe that the anti-Christ will claim that it is punishment for their sins and "false religion" just as Jesus was accused of being "punished" for His sins.God bless.
QUOTE (Denver @ Apr 26 2009, 07:33 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=73030
Simple answer, the world will be so enamored with the false Christ that shows up first.
It may be quicker than many think. This false prophet bringing fire down from heaven. Satan in human form, deception beyond understanding, except for those whose names are written in the Lamb's book of life. (Rev 13:8)
Simple answer, the world will be so enamored with the false Christ that shows up first.
It may be quicker than many think. This false prophet bringing fire down from heaven. Satan in human form, deception beyond understanding, except for those whose names are written in the Lamb's book of life. (Rev 13:8)
QUOTE
"I wondered passively for a couple of years how those left behind after the Rapture were going to be conned into believing that the Rapture actually did not take place.
Some of them will know the rapture didn't happen because they had read and understood the Scripture, and know that there isn't a rapture.QUOTE (Vickie @ Apr 26 2009, 11:01 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=73038
It may be quicker than many think. This false prophet bringing fire down from heaven. Satan in human form, deception beyond understanding, except for those whose names are written in the Lamb's book of life. (Rev 13:8)
The false prophet isn't the only one that brings fire from Heaven. He doesn't even know what Real fire is!
"I wondered passively for a couple of years how those left behind after the Rapture were going to be conned into believing that the Rapture actually did not take place.
Some of them will know the rapture didn't happen because they had read and understood the Scripture, and know that there isn't a rapture.QUOTE (Vickie @ Apr 26 2009, 11:01 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=73038
It may be quicker than many think. This false prophet bringing fire down from heaven. Satan in human form, deception beyond understanding, except for those whose names are written in the Lamb's book of life. (Rev 13:8)
The false prophet isn't the only one that brings fire from Heaven. He doesn't even know what Real fire is!
I don't think the lies they have been told about the rapture disqualifies them for the kingdom of God. For God said to believe in Him and repent of our sins, that is what saves us. Christ also said that the Shepherds will be held to a higher accountability than the fold for teachings they've given God's children. I believe and know God well enough to say, Our Lord will not let HIS CHILDREN that belong to him go through this without him leading them and directing them and opening their eyes. One who offers service to the family of God and to God is showing our Lord that the seed has taken root in us and he will water us and bring us up to par. God is not unfaithful to those who love him.A simple doctrine is not the bases for God to cast one to the side, but rather for him to come in and restore the person who is under his blood that has received a false doctrine, for our Lord is faithful to those that LOVE HIM. We need to remember there are many parts of the body in many places and they all serve God's purpose, and they all have different doctrines for the most part. Some are Sunday keepers some are Sabbath keepers, and some are everyday keepers. As long as they have entered into God's rest. VickieThe false prophet isn't the only one that brings fire from Heaven. He doesn't even know what Real fire is![/quote]
QUOTE
It may be quicker than many think. This false prophet bringing fire down from heaven.Satan in human form, deception beyond understanding, except for those whose names are written in the Lamb'sbook of life. (Rev 13:8)
Think about the rockstars and politicians now. Now imagine someone that really can make things change and snap his fingers to produce lightning. The whole thing is, though, that he shows up first with this talent to deceive the most possible. I rue the day for those that are not sealed and have neglected reading the Word of God opting instead for so called prophecy books. They have no one to blame but themselves.In the Spirit of Elijah, I am compelled to say "Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand." (Matthew 3:2)QUOTE
The false prophet isn't the only one that brings fire from Heaven. He doesn't even know what Real fire is!
Amen indeed! There is only one consuming fire which will never be quenched!!QUOTE
I don't think the lies they have been told about the rapture disqualifies them for the kingdom of God. For God said to believe in Him andrepent of our sins, that is what saves us. Christ also said that the Shepherds will be held to a higher accountability than the fold for teachingsthey've given God's children.
I don't either (and, in fact, I believe many who believe the rapture lie will be saved when they awake from the lie in time), but whoring after the false Christ will ensure destruction! That's not an excuse when the Word is in front of them! They'll pray for mountains to fall on them and I do not want to see that, and I don't think any real Christian should.Christ died for all, but the responsibility of all is to acknowledge, accept, and follow Him. Salvation is conditional!QUOTE
John 3:14-17And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
Those who follow will be saved, but it's through more than lip service!
It may be quicker than many think. This false prophet bringing fire down from heaven.Satan in human form, deception beyond understanding, except for those whose names are written in the Lamb'sbook of life. (Rev 13:8)
Think about the rockstars and politicians now. Now imagine someone that really can make things change and snap his fingers to produce lightning. The whole thing is, though, that he shows up first with this talent to deceive the most possible. I rue the day for those that are not sealed and have neglected reading the Word of God opting instead for so called prophecy books. They have no one to blame but themselves.In the Spirit of Elijah, I am compelled to say "Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand." (Matthew 3:2)QUOTE
The false prophet isn't the only one that brings fire from Heaven. He doesn't even know what Real fire is!
Amen indeed! There is only one consuming fire which will never be quenched!!QUOTE
I don't think the lies they have been told about the rapture disqualifies them for the kingdom of God. For God said to believe in Him andrepent of our sins, that is what saves us. Christ also said that the Shepherds will be held to a higher accountability than the fold for teachingsthey've given God's children.
I don't either (and, in fact, I believe many who believe the rapture lie will be saved when they awake from the lie in time), but whoring after the false Christ will ensure destruction! That's not an excuse when the Word is in front of them! They'll pray for mountains to fall on them and I do not want to see that, and I don't think any real Christian should.Christ died for all, but the responsibility of all is to acknowledge, accept, and follow Him. Salvation is conditional!QUOTE
John 3:14-17And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
Those who follow will be saved, but it's through more than lip service!
QUOTE (Denver @ Apr 27 2009, 01:33 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=73061
I don't either (and, in fact, I believe many who believe the rapture lie will be saved when they awake from the lie in time), but whoring after the false Christ will ensure destruction! That's not an excuse when the Word is in front of them! They'll pray for mountains to fall on them and I do not want to see that, and I don't think any real Christian should.Christ died for all, but the responsibility of all is to acknowledge, accept, and follow Him. Salvation is conditional!Those who follow will be saved, but it's through more than lip service!
Of course it is more than lip service. It has to do with fearing God. who really fears him? Who fears him to the point toconsider how they behave towards others? The Lord says we will tremble in his presence. Jeremiah 5:22 First of all God says clearly those "WHOSE NAME IS WRITTEN IN THE LAMB'S BOOK OF LIFE WILL NOT TAKE THE MARK." Rev 13:8. The bible is clear there is a big rebellion that occurs 2 Thess 2:3, those who are the Elect are in the Lamb's book of life already and they will not be rebelling against God. So, I feel IMHO that those who are not the elect are the ones who rebel and take the mark, for God did go so far to say those who are in the Lamb's book of life won't be taking it. We have been set apart for we have a mission, of being purified by God and made spotless, as it is right now the condition we are all in we are notspotless, but still corruptible until his coming. Zech 13:9 This 1/3 I will bring through the fire. I will refine them like sliver and test them like gold,they will call out to me and I will answer them. The question is just who is the Elect? They are chosen out of those called. Not one human being can determine who is right in thier hearts with Christ except Christ. We have not right to judge another in this matter. But know that our name can be removed from the Lamb's book of life as called and not chosen. Vickie
I don't either (and, in fact, I believe many who believe the rapture lie will be saved when they awake from the lie in time), but whoring after the false Christ will ensure destruction! That's not an excuse when the Word is in front of them! They'll pray for mountains to fall on them and I do not want to see that, and I don't think any real Christian should.Christ died for all, but the responsibility of all is to acknowledge, accept, and follow Him. Salvation is conditional!Those who follow will be saved, but it's through more than lip service!
Of course it is more than lip service. It has to do with fearing God. who really fears him? Who fears him to the point toconsider how they behave towards others? The Lord says we will tremble in his presence. Jeremiah 5:22 First of all God says clearly those "WHOSE NAME IS WRITTEN IN THE LAMB'S BOOK OF LIFE WILL NOT TAKE THE MARK." Rev 13:8. The bible is clear there is a big rebellion that occurs 2 Thess 2:3, those who are the Elect are in the Lamb's book of life already and they will not be rebelling against God. So, I feel IMHO that those who are not the elect are the ones who rebel and take the mark, for God did go so far to say those who are in the Lamb's book of life won't be taking it. We have been set apart for we have a mission, of being purified by God and made spotless, as it is right now the condition we are all in we are notspotless, but still corruptible until his coming. Zech 13:9 This 1/3 I will bring through the fire. I will refine them like sliver and test them like gold,they will call out to me and I will answer them. The question is just who is the Elect? They are chosen out of those called. Not one human being can determine who is right in thier hearts with Christ except Christ. We have not right to judge another in this matter. But know that our name can be removed from the Lamb's book of life as called and not chosen. Vickie
QUOTE
The bible is clear there is a big rebellion that occurs 2 Thess 2:3, those who are the Elect are in the Lamb's book of life already and they willnot be rebelling against God. So, I feel IMHO that those who are not the elect are the ones who rebel and take the mark, for God did go sofar to say those who are in the Lamb's book of life won't be taking it.
I cannot accept that stance.QUOTE
Mark 5:13-14Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be salted? it is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under foot of men. Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid. Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house. Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.
The second advent, the return or our Lord, is fully included in that I will not be convinced otherwise. Salt goes all over what it seasons, it doesn't concentrate in this area or that. Neither does the Word of God.
The bible is clear there is a big rebellion that occurs 2 Thess 2:3, those who are the Elect are in the Lamb's book of life already and they willnot be rebelling against God. So, I feel IMHO that those who are not the elect are the ones who rebel and take the mark, for God did go sofar to say those who are in the Lamb's book of life won't be taking it.
I cannot accept that stance.QUOTE
Mark 5:13-14Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be salted? it is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under foot of men. Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid. Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house. Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.
The second advent, the return or our Lord, is fully included in that I will not be convinced otherwise. Salt goes all over what it seasons, it doesn't concentrate in this area or that. Neither does the Word of God.
QUOTE (Vickie @ Apr 27 2009, 02:56 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=73064
...The question is just who is the Elect? They are chosen out of those called. Not one human being can determine who is right in thier hearts with Christ except Christ. We have not right to judge another in this matter. But know that our name can be removed from the Lamb's book of life as called and not chosen. Vickie
If what you are saying was true this whole flesh body age is one big “crapshoot.” That is absolutely wrong. We can know with certainty who we are as “called” and “chosen.”
...The question is just who is the Elect? They are chosen out of those called. Not one human being can determine who is right in thier hearts with Christ except Christ. We have not right to judge another in this matter. But know that our name can be removed from the Lamb's book of life as called and not chosen. Vickie
If what you are saying was true this whole flesh body age is one big “crapshoot.” That is absolutely wrong. We can know with certainty who we are as “called” and “chosen.”
QUOTE (Denver @ Apr 27 2009, 04:03 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=73068
I cannot accept that stance.The second advent, the return or our Lord, is fully included in that I will not be convinced otherwise. Salt goes all over what it seasons, it doesn't concentrate in this area or that. Neither does the Word of God.
I see what your saying from those scriptures and it is true, we can lose our salt if we turn away from God. Perhaps this is just an area were God has not made it totally clear. Here is another verse.Rev 17:8 (last part) The inhabitants of the earth "WHOSE NAMES HAVE NOT BEEN WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF LIFE FROM THE CREATION OF THE WORLD WILL BE ASTONISHED when they see the beast, who once was, now is , and soon to come. Now from this verse it appears that God has some from the beginning of the creation whose names are NOT WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF LIFE. What is your opinion here? One thing we might consider is that when the Son of Perdition is revealed from that point on, those who did not leave will be those who are written in the Lamb's book of life from that point on.I do agree with you that we can turn away from God, but I think when you've come to see the evilness that abounds in this world escalate as it is now into full blown Satanism, I don't think any Christian can turn and go that kind of life style. I couldn't. As it is for me now to see evil I get upset at it. So, I know for me I would rather just die then to have that mind set. Vickie
I cannot accept that stance.The second advent, the return or our Lord, is fully included in that I will not be convinced otherwise. Salt goes all over what it seasons, it doesn't concentrate in this area or that. Neither does the Word of God.
I see what your saying from those scriptures and it is true, we can lose our salt if we turn away from God. Perhaps this is just an area were God has not made it totally clear. Here is another verse.Rev 17:8 (last part) The inhabitants of the earth "WHOSE NAMES HAVE NOT BEEN WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF LIFE FROM THE CREATION OF THE WORLD WILL BE ASTONISHED when they see the beast, who once was, now is , and soon to come. Now from this verse it appears that God has some from the beginning of the creation whose names are NOT WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF LIFE. What is your opinion here? One thing we might consider is that when the Son of Perdition is revealed from that point on, those who did not leave will be those who are written in the Lamb's book of life from that point on.I do agree with you that we can turn away from God, but I think when you've come to see the evilness that abounds in this world escalate as it is now into full blown Satanism, I don't think any Christian can turn and go that kind of life style. I couldn't. As it is for me now to see evil I get upset at it. So, I know for me I would rather just die then to have that mind set. Vickie
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