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Featured Take the Law away..

Discussion in 'Christian Theology Forum' started by Behold, Jun 26, 2020.

  1. Behold

    Behold Well-Known Member

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    Sin is only available as a fact and a title to someone who is "under the law".
    Its the LAW that defines sin as sin, and a sinner as a sinner.
    Take the Law away..
    "Christ came to redeem us from the curse of the law"
    Take the law away.
    "you are not under the Law, you are under Grace".

    So, now, "sin" is where the law is found, and Christians are not found defined by the law.
    We are "under Grace".
    Unbelievers are sinners, not you., if you are born again.

    Saints do not sin, because Saints are not under the law.
    Now calm down....:)
    You are committing carnal deeds that you define as a "sin", but God does not..... And you think this way because you have been trained by a liar to believe that is how you are supposed to believe.
    You BELIEVE you will sin and confess and repent. = "as a man thinketh in his heart"..."what you believe is what you are".
    So first, stop believing that you are a "saved sinner", when you are not.
    Next, realize that you are walking in your carnal mind when you are in a lifestyle that is "sinning, confessing, and repenting".
    And how do you know, ?? Because if you are not in that carnal mind you wont be sinning and confessing and repenting.
    "If you walk in the Spirit (The Mind of Christ) you wont SIN"... = "you wont fulfill works of the Flesh".

    How do you stop?
    Read my Threads.
    They will talk to you about elevating your believing INTO God's perspective of you.
    Thats the entrance into the holy lifestyle.

    Im here to To teach you about this, to help you out of that lifelong bondage.
    It takes time because its a matter of re-learning how to SEE yourself as God sees you.
    You have to find your way into the Grace of God, in your mind.
    You are already there through Jesus as "eternal life", but you have a mind that will want to perceive yourself as "sinner", "not good". "i just did it again"... "God im sorry, but its the same old sin"... ect.
    Listen, you are not that. That is just sin consciousness playing out through your behavior.
    God will give you Victory over all this, as you find your way into right believing.
    You must become this... Hebrews 13:9
    You must get your own heart established in the GRACE of God and keep it there.

    Im here now a few weeks... and most of you have been confessing and repenting for years..
    Let God work in you. Let yourself believe that you are always at peace with God, because of Jesus making this so...
    God is never angry with you. God is on your side. You always have peace with God if you are born again, even on your worst day.
    The blood of Jesus keeps you always in peace with God.
    Listen, .. feelings are not facts...they are only feelings.. So, the fact is, the blood of Jesus always keeps you at peace and in the peace of God, no matter how you feel about this, day by day.
    Some of you are starting to see some Light, and this is going to change your life, TOWARD God.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2020
  2. amadeus

    amadeus Well-Known Member

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    What is with this: Me, myself and I? What about Jesus? What about the Holy Ghost?

    "Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
    Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
    For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light." Matt 11:28-30

    "But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you" John 14:26
     
  3. Behold

    Behold Well-Known Member

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    Hebrews 13:9.

    This verse teaches that you are to be "heart established" in the Grace of God and in no other Theology.
    You have to become a student of the Grace of God.
    What is the Grace of God?
    Its Jesus.
     
  4. Behold

    Behold Well-Known Member

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    If you closely read my Thread, you can post something thats related to it, next time.
    See, people who are sinning and confessing are not really "heavy laden", they are "wrongly taught".
    So, i teach them how to get away from really bad theology and into right believing.

    And a question for you.
    Do you sin and repent and confess?
     
  5. amadeus

    amadeus Well-Known Member

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    You swerved around my question. Why should I answer your question and deal with you instead of some other man?

    Then again why should I deal with any man instead of with Jesus and the Holy Ghost?

    Do you have some special gift or revelation from God more than the others who also claim to have 'good' theology?

    Can a person approach God without what men name theology?
     
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  6. Episkopos

    Episkopos Well-Known Member

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    Take the law away? This is a confusion of different laws. An utter confusion and tangle of ideas. Under the law means that we are walking as human beings...in the power of the flesh. As such we will sin. Jesus did NOT come to take the law away. Quite the opposite. He came to show that His power (in us) can fulfill the law. Otherwise there would be no need for power from God. If all God does is relax the law for certain people (which He would NEVER do) there is no need of resurrection life or holiness. Jesus need not have come at all. Why die for a permission to sin. Does God change holiness? Does He ever change? Of course not. So we needed the power to be as Jesus in this world. As He is... so now (IF we are IN Christ in the Spirit) so are we ....(Again IF we are walking in the kingdom life as He did)... in this world.

    So your scheme is in deep error.

    Your errant theory makes God to be a respecter of persons and to be partial to certain people. But there is NO favoritism with God. ALL sinning is treated the same no matter who does it. Any other scheme is unrighteous.

    The law of sin and death is inescapable by the power of the flesh. But there is a new law of the Spirit made available to us that flies over the law of the flesh just as the law of flight overcomes gravity. So there is no need to cancel any laws. An airplane doesn't cancel the law of gravity. it doesn't judge a smaller person or lighter person as someone who can break the law of gravity. We are ALL subject to the law of God. No one is ever exempt from the law of God. To not be UNDER the law means we walk by a different law...a law that overcomes the law that limited us before.

    Jesus came to fulfill the law and empower us by grace to do just as He did...through His perfected walk in the Spirit ...while we are yet in these mortal bodies. Enter into Him and walk as He did...in God's holy presence without sin.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2020
  7. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    "Sin is not imputed where there is no law." (Romans 5:13).

    This indicates that where there is no law, there is no transgression (Romans 4:15); and transgression is a violation of some standard. So, where the standard is absent, there is no violation of that standard.

    Notice that it says that sin is not imputed. This does not say that sin does not exist where there is no law; but that the law no longer points the finger at the sinner, calling him one, where the law does not exist.

    Before the law was given by Moses, sin was in the world (Romans 5:13); but sin was not imputed because there was no law.

    If you understand these truths I believe you will be able to sift through what @Behold is teaching and come to a proper conclusion.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2020
  8. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    This is true for the believer in Christ; but you are teaching falsely because there are those who will be listening to you who are not believers.

    The Bible says,

    Psa 5:5, The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.
    Psa 5:6, Thou shalt destroy them that speak leasing: the LORD will abhor the bloody and deceitful man.

    Psa 7:11, God judgeth the righteous, and God is angry with the wicked every day.
     
  9. quietthinker

    quietthinker Well-Known Member

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  10. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Those who are in Christ are not under the law (Romans 6:14), are dead to the law (Romans 7:4, Galatians 2:19) and are delivered from the law (Romans 7:6). We are no longer married to the law; but to Christ.

    You seem here to be promoting the concept that Jesus did not die to bring forgiveness of sins. For the fact that we are forgiven of past, present, and future sins means that the law does not condemn us from the outside any longer (Romans 6:14, Romans 7:4, Galatians 2:18, Romans 7:6; Ephesians 2:15-15, Colossians 2:14, Hebrews 7:18-19).

    The believer who has received forgiveness of sins does not receive the same treatment as the one who does not have forgiveness. Those who are unforgiven will be judged and condemned; while the forgiven cannot be condemned (John 5:24).

    We can supersede the law of gravity by utilizing the law of aerodynamics; so that an airplane can indeed fly contrary to the law of gravity (without violating its principles).
     
  11. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    Your theology is getting more and more BIZARRE and NONSENSICAL.
     
  12. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Actually, that part makes sense; because he is speaking of the fact that where there is no law there is no transgression (Romans 4:15) and therefore no sin (see 1 John 3:4). Therefore, since saints are not under the law, the law does not apply to them and therefore it is to them as if there is no law.

    You have to think about these things for a little while, I would gather.
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2020
  13. Behold

    Behold Well-Known Member

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    And you didnt answer my question..
    But thats ok, as i knew you couldn't.
    You sin, and you repent, and you've been saved a long time old fella, and you've never yet been able to live a Christian discipleship, that is free from that situation.
    So, you want to correct me, while you are not able to live a perfected discipleship, when i can show you how?
    RETHINK your position, as you have been too long in the wasteland, amadeus.

    Also, does God give Apostles and Prophets, and Teachers, to the body of Christ?
    So, if you meet one here, you are shocked and stupefied??
    Really?
    Listen, Read your NT, a little me, and put your commentaries in the trash
    .
     
  14. Behold

    Behold Well-Known Member

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    My Threads are not written to unbelievers.
    This is pretty obvious, as even you could figure it out.
    The question is...... you are a person who is sinning and repenting, and you are not able to stop.
    Would it not be smarter to put into practice what im teaching, instead of defying Paul when he told you that if you walk in the flesh you wont sin?

    You figure that out....
     
  15. Behold

    Behold Well-Known Member

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    The confusion is within your head, episkopos.
    See, im not talking about "different laws", im detailing Paul's teaching regarding not being "under the law", but "under grace".
    You have no idea what im talking about, and this is unlikely to change because you are too full of yourself to even consider that you are locked away in a cult that has not even been able to help you understand the first principles of soteriology.
    This will never change, because you will never change.
    So, rave on raver.
     
  16. Episkopos

    Episkopos Well-Known Member

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    To inform others on the forum on how easy it is to become just as confused as the OP about what Paul means by being "under the law"...

    The law of Moses: These are specific holiness laws that represent Judaism...or what it means to be Jewish. One can be "not under the law" as a non-Jew who was not meant to try obeying laws meant for the people of God.

    Examples of this kind of law were the dress codes, the kosher eating, the Sabbath, circumcision, the sacrificial system...etc

    The law of God: The 10 commandments. These can be further boiled down to love of God and love of neighbour. Everyone is always subject to the law of God...and will be judged against it. Paul is NOT saying we are not responsible to love. Only the lawless enemies of God refuse the law of God.

    The law of sin and death: This is a righteousness law towards the power of the flesh that causes us to sin. The soul that sins...it shall die. They who walk in the new power of life (grace) are no longer subject to this law of death...because the law of life in Christ Jesus is stronger. Grace overcomes sin. Grace is stronger than sin. The life of Christ is stronger than the life from the Adamic nature. He that is within us (who are filled with the Spirit) is greater than he that is in the world. The higher law of life sets us free from the lower law of death. THAT is what it means to be free of the law. Life trumps death in a crucified person...because you are already dead in the part that is subject to death. A dead man is free to be joined to another kind of life...the eternal life in Christ. Just as a women whose husband is dead is free to marry another. A widow is no longer UNDER THE LAW of her husband....because he is dead....or else...we are no longer under the law of sin because WE are dead. Either way death breaks the hold of the law on us.
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2020
  17. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    No. That is TOTAL NONSENSE.

    No one has the right to take Scriptures out of context and manufacture their own theology. Christians are under THE LAW OF CHRIST: Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the Law of Christ. (Gal 6:2) Paul explains the Law of Christ as corresponding to the Law of Love which corresponds to the Ten Commandments.

    ROMANS 13: THE TEN COMMANDMENTS ARE WITHIN THE LAW OF CHRIST

    7 Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour. 8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the Law. 9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the Law.
    ****************************

    Question: "What is the law of Christ?"
    Answer: Galatians 6:2 states, “Carry each other’s burdens, and in this way you will fulfill the law of Christ (emphasis added). What exactly is the law of Christ, and how is it fulfilled by carrying each other’s burdens?

    While the law of Christ is also mentioned in
    1 Corinthians 9:21, the Bible nowhere specifically defines what precisely is the law of Christ. However, most Bible teachers understand the law of Christ to be what Christ stated were the greatest commandments in Mark 12:28–31, “‘Which commandment is the most important of all?’ Jesus answered, ‘The most important is, “Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.” The second is this: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” There is no other commandment greater than these.’”

    The law of Christ, then, is to love God with all of our being and to love our neighbors as we love ourselves. In Mark 12:32–33, the scribe who asked Jesus the question responds with, “To love him with all your heart, with all your understanding and with all your strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices.” In this, Jesus and the scribe agreed that those two commands are the core of the entire Old Testament Law. All of the Old Testament Law can be placed in the category of “loving God” or “loving your neighbor.”

    Various New Testament scriptures state that Jesus fulfilled the Old Testament Law, bringing it to completion and conclusion (Romans 10:4; Galatians 3:23–25; Ephesians 2:15).

    In place of the Old Testament Law, Christians are to obey the law of Christ. Rather than trying to remember the over 600 individual commandments in the Old Testament Law, Christians are simply to focus on loving God and loving others. If Christians would truly and wholeheartedly obey those two commands, we would be fulfilling everything that God requires of us.


    Christ freed us from the bondage of the hundreds of commands in the Old Testament Law and instead calls on us to love. First John 4:7–8 declares, “Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God, and whoever loves has been born of God and knows God. Anyone who does not love does not know God, because God is love.” First John 5:3 continues, “This is love for God: to obey His commands. And His commands are not burdensome.”

    Some use the fact that we are not under the Old Testament Law as an excuse to sin. The apostle Paul addresses this very issue in Romans. “What then? Are we to sin because we are not under law but under grace? By no means!” (Romans 6:15).

    For the follower of Christ, the avoidance of sin is to be accomplished out of love for God and love for others. Love is to be our motivation. When we recognize the value of Jesus’ sacrifice on our behalf, our response is to be love, gratitude, and obedience. When we understand the sacrifice Jesus made for us and others, our response is to be to follow His example in expressing love to others. Our motivation for overcoming sin should be love, not a desire to legalistically obey a series of commandments. We are to obey the law of Christ because we love Him, not so that we can check off a list of commands that we successfully obeyed.

    What is the law of Christ? | GotQuestions.org
     
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  18. amadeus

    amadeus Well-Known Member

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    You fail to answer but press with a strange voice to receive an answer while saying, "Read...a little me". Consider what Apostle Paul wrote:

    "Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?" I Cor 5:6

    "...and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.
    And a stranger will they not follow," John 10:4-5
     
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  19. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    The answer is...no.
     
  20. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    I have a question for you.

    For the believer, does the law of Christ condemn the believer who doesn't live up to it?

    Personally, I believe that we are forgiven of past, present, and future sins as Christians; and that therefore our relationship to the law has changed. How can the law condemn us if we are forgiven?

    The Bible teaches that we are not under the law (Romans 6:14) are dead to the law (Romans 7:4, Galatians 2:19) and are delivered from the law (Romans 7:6) (see also Ephesians 2:15-16, Colossians 2:14, and Hebrews 7:18-19)...and this means that the law no longer condemns us from the outside, as being written on tablets of stone.

    On the other side of the coin, the law governs us from the inside (Hebrews 8:8-10, Hebrews 10:16, Romans 8:7, Romans 8:4) as being written on fleshy tables of human hearts.

    This combination means that our new nature as born again believers motivates us to be obedient while in any instance where we should fail to be so, we are covered by the blood of Jesus Christ and are forgiven.

    The law therefore cannot condemn us as believers.
     
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