Rapture is not in the Bible

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Most Christians believe they will at some point "get to heaven" where God is dwelling. Some do not believe you go to heaven at death, but that death is a sleep until the resurrection, then when Jesus returns to raise the righteous dead, all go back with Him to heaven for a thousand years, until the new earth comes into being. Others believe that Christ returns to "rapture" His Church away from the terrible tribulation then taking place on the earth, and that they spent either 7 years or 3 1/2 years in heaven, before returning again with Christ to set up the Kingdom of God on earth for a thousand years.
Whatever the various beliefs of certain religious sects and denominations is on this matter, just about all of them teach and believe that the good Christian will someday, for some period of time "go to heaven" where the Father lives and dwells in the heavenly Jerusalem.

IF WE SHALL GO TO HEAVEN ONE DAY....
And if this is a fundamental plain teaching of the Bible, then surely we should be able to find many verses all over the Bible saying things such as: "When we get to heaven," "When we see each other in heaven," "They are up there in heaven with God," "We shall go to heaven at Christ's return," "We shall be in heaven where God is one day." BUT VERSES LIKE THIS CANNOT BE FOUND IN THE BIBLE!

BUT, what we do read in the Bible is the Words of Jesus: No man goes to heaven, except the One who came from there. John 3:13 Where I go, you cannot come. John 7:34 Your home is in this world, Mine is not. John 8:23 I do not pray, Father, that You take them out of this world.... John 17:15

So the truth is, the idea of a 'rapture to heaven', is a straight out Satanic lie; one of his most successful ones, that will cause many unprepared Christians to fall on the Day of trial. 1 Peter 4:12, 1 Corinthians 3:13-15

Most Christians think that heaven is our destination and preachers tout it from the pulpit. Why then didn't the people of the Bible use such language? Could it be that they knew that going off to heaven where God the Father now dwells was NEVER promised to any earthy mortal person?

The word "heaven" is used 570 times in the Bible. "Heavenly" appears 23 times and "heavens" is used 121 times. Surely, somewhere, in all those uses we can find a statement: "When we are in heaven" or "We are going to go to heaven" or maybe "He has gone to God in heaven." If you take a Bible concordance you can find all the verses where "heaven," "heavenly," and heavens" are used throughout the Bible. Look them up! See if you can find a verse that says, "We shall go to heaven," "Heaven is our eternal abode," "They are up in heaven" or any plain statement about Christians or children of God going to be with God in heaven for ANY length of time. You have over 500 places where "heaven" is used. Try to find any verse that tells us clearly we shall someday, sometime, go to live where God the Father dwells.

There are THREE heavens mentioned in the Bible. 1) The heaven [atmosphere] where the birds fly. 2) the heaven [space] where the planets and stars are. 3) The heaven [spiritual] where God's throne is, where God is now.
I knew a man in Christ.... caught up to the THIRD heaven....He was caught up into Paradise, and heard unspeakable words....2 Cor. 12:2-4 The third heaven is where God dwells!

KINGDOM OF HEAVEN ?
Some will say, "Well Christ talked about our being in the Kingdom of heaven. Surely that proves we shall 'go to heaven'. If it does, then some shall be in heaven while others are not. Matthew 5:3-5. Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the Kingdom of heaven....blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth. The Kingdom OF heaven is the Kingdom that BELONGS to heaven. It is owned and operated by heaven. the Kingdom that BELONGS to God, not the Kingdom inside God. The Gospels according to Mark and Luke use "Kingdom OF God"

OUR REWARD IS IN HEAVEN
Is not our reward to go to heaven? Are there not some verses that say something to that effect? Here they are: Rejoice, and be exceeding glad; for great is your reward in heaven.... Matthew 5:12 Do not display your religion before others, if you do you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. Matthew 6:1 But lay up for yourselves treasure in heaven.....Luke 6:23 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled…reserved in heaven for you. 1 Peter 1:4

Now, let's be honest. Do the above verses say: "Our reward is to get to heaven" or "When we get to heaven we shall be given our reward." Do these verses say: "Our reserved inheritance is to get to heaven to be with God" ? No, they do not! Truly, Christians will receive rewards and we are to inherit eternal life, but when? Eternal life comes at the resurrection. Read 1 Cor.15; Rev.2:10; 2 Tim.4:8 Our rewards are to be given to us by Christ at His return. And, behold, I come quickly, and MY REWARD IS WITH ME, to give every man according as his work shall be.
Rev. 22:12 Our rewards and inheritance are reserved in heaven. They come down out of heaven with Christ at his return.

NAMED TO GO TO HEAVEN?
Are not Christians named and written down in a book to go to heaven? ….but rather rejoice, because your names are written in heaven Luke 10:20 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven....Heb. 12:23

Do these verses say, "Because you will go to heaven" or "The church of the firstborn will one day get to heaven" ? No! Our names (God knows who are His) are written down in the book of life, the book of life being in heaven. But we receive life eternal after the Great White Throne Judgement, when the Book of Life is opened. Revelation 20:11-15

OUR HOPE....TO GO TO HEAVEN?
For the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, whereof you heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel. Col.1:5 What is the hope for Christians? Paul answers in another letter he wrote: But if there be NO RESURRECTION of the dead, then Christ is not risen. And if Christ is not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.....then they which are also fallen asleep in Christ are PERISHED....For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man on his own order: Christ the firstfruits: AFTERWARDS they that are Christ's AT HIS COMING. 1 Cor. 15: 13-23

Our HOPE is Christ, who has been raised from the dead and is now in heaven, waiting to be sent back to this earth when He shall RESURRECT the DEAD. 1 Thes.4: 16

Colossians 1:5 does NOT say, "Our hope is to get to heaven." Or "The church's hope is to be with Christ in heaven." It says: our HOPE is kept in heaven. That hope is Christ and His Return. Philippians 3:20 Christian believers are citizens of heaven and from heaven we can expect our Deliverer to come: The Lord Jesus Christ.

Notice! This Kingdom is in heaven that we are citizens of. If we be Christ's, we belong to His family. We are brothers of His, we are part of God's family, His children, and so of His government, kingdom, which is at present in heaven. Not that we are in heaven, for the reality is: we live on earth, but the Kingdom, where our citizenship is; that we now belong to, is in heaven.

NO MAN HAS EVER GONE TO HEAVEN
Here is a plain and easy to understand verse: And NO MAN has ASCENDED up to heaven, except for He that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven. John 3:13 BELIEVE what Christ said, He should know. He was in heaven with the Father from the beginning, and He did not see any human ever come from earth up to heaven. It’s indisputable, Enoch could not have gone to the third heaven, neither did Moses, nor did Elijah. All humans who have ever lived, or will live, up to the Return of Jesus and are not still alive when Jesus comes, will sleep in death. They will be in the grave, and the martyrs, those killed for their faith, Revelation 20:4, wait to hear the voice of the Son of man, to rise from the dead in a resurrection. Then, for a thousand years they shall reign with Christ on His throne over this earth, as they establish the Kingdom of God on earth.

At the end of the thousand years comes the new heavens and the new earth. Then the heavenly Jerusalem together with God the Father will come from heaven to this new earth, which will then become the dwelling place of the throne of the universe for all Eternity.

What we can say is that we, the children of God, will one day be in heaven.....yes.....when heaven comes to earth. Revelation 21:1-4 But what we cannot say is that any human will be taken up to heaven to avoid the wrath to come. The Lord promises protection to all these who place their trust in Him and this may be a profound spiritual experience. Nahum 1:1-8, Isaiah 43:2, Luke 21:34-36 Ref: Keith Hunt
 
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Copperhead

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That text in Revelation says that a new Jerusalem comes down, but nothing about the Shamayim (heaven). Kind of playing fast and loose with the text, aren't you?
 

Heb 13:8

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The verse says those who have died will Christ bring back,not those who were raptured

1 Thess 4:16-17 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up (harpazo) together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.

Rev 12:5 She gave birth to a son (huios Jesus Christ himself), a male child, who “will rule all the nations with an iron scepter.” And her child (teknon the church) was snatched up (harpazo) to God and to his throne.

(1.) The Feast of Trumpets represents rapture, the appointed time (Gen 1:14 moed/seasons) (Lev 23:2 moed/festivals)


(2.) The word harpazo/rapture is a part of the Rev 12:1-5 sign, in Rev 12:5

(3.) The Latin translation for rapture is rapturo, in Greek it's harpazo

(4.) In Dan 12:11, we are the sacrifice taken away that kicks off the 1290 days (Isa 53:11 amal/trouble, Rev 7:14 thlipsis/trouble), Rom 8:17, Rom 12:1, Rom 15:16, 1 Cor 15:31, 2 Cor 1:5, Gal 2:20, Phil 2:17, Phil 3:10, Col 1:24

(5.) Rapture before tribulation is here Gen 19:21-22, Lev 12:1-8, Psa 18:2, Psa 27:5, Isa 26:17-21, Isa 66:7-8, 1 Thess 5:9-10, (Jude 1:14, Rev 19:14 saints coming back to earth), Rev 3:10, Rev 4:4, Rev 5:5, Rev 12:1-5

- Heb 13:8
 
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Heb 13:8

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Where does those verses say we go to Heaven?

Rapture before tribulation is here Gen 19:21-22, Lev 12:1-8, Psa 18:2, Psa 27:5, Isa 26:17-21, Isa 66:7-8, 1 Thess 5:9-10, (Jude 1:14, Rev 19:14 saints coming back to earth), Rev 3:10, Rev 4:4, Rev 5:5, Rev 12:1-5

The body of Christ will rule and reign with Christ himself with an iron scepter, as kings and priests Psa 2:9, Dan 7:18, 22, Matt 19:28, Rom 8:17, 1 Cor 6:2-3, Rev 1:5-6, Rev 2:26-27, Rev 3:21, Rev 4:4, Rev 5:10-11, Rev 7:9, Rev 12:5, Rev 20:4-6, Rev 22:5

The twenty-four elders (the church/martyrs) playing harps in heaven Psa 33:2, Rev 5:8, Rev 14:2-3, Rev 15:2

- Heb 13:8
 

Copperhead

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Rev 12:5 She gave birth to a son (huios Jesus Christ himself), a male child, who “will rule all the nations with an iron scepter.” And her child (teknon the church) was snatched up (harpazo) to God and to his throne.

Excellent post. Just add Revelation 2:26-27 to it that shows those who overcome also rule with a rod of iron. That supports the idea that the child in 12:5 is the church.

Edit: My bad. You did show it.
 

Heb 13:8

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Jesus will gather His people when He Returns, just as Matthew 24:31 says. To where He is; in Jerusalem.

Matt 24:31 is referring to the "great trump" which occurs at the end of the 70th week. Notice the word "loud" in Matt 24:31 is translated "great". The "last trump" in 1 Cor 15:52 and the "great trump" in Matt 24:31 are seven years apart. Also notice the word "gather" is translated "episunagó". This word is not a "harpazo". These are two different words with two different meanings.
 

Heb 13:8

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Excellent post. Just add Revelation 2:26-27 to it that shows those who overcome also rule with a rod of iron. That supports the idea that the child in 12:5 is the church.

Edit: My bad. You did show it.

Yup, and those who overcome are believing in the finished work of the cross. 1 John 5:4-5. God Bless You.
 

ScottA

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1 Thess 4:16-17 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up (harpazo) together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.

Rev 12:5 She gave birth to a son (huios Jesus Christ himself), a male child, who “will rule all the nations with an iron scepter.” And her child (teknon the church) was snatched up (harpazo) to God and to his throne.

(1.) The Feast of Trumpets represents rapture, the appointed time (Gen 1:14 moed/seasons) (Lev 23:2 moed/festivals)


(2.) The word harpazo/rapture is a part of the Rev 12:1-5 sign, in Rev 12:5

(3.) The Latin translation for rapture is rapturo, in Greek it's harpazo

(4.) In Dan 12:11, we are the sacrifice taken away that kicks off the 1290 days (Isa 53:11 amal/trouble, Rev 7:14 thlipsis/trouble), Rom 8:17, Rom 12:1, Rom 15:16, 1 Cor 15:31, 2 Cor 1:5, Gal 2:20, Phil 2:17, Phil 3:10, Col 1:24

(5.) Rapture before tribulation is here Gen 19:21-22, Lev 12:1-8, Psa 18:2, Psa 27:5, Isa 26:17-21, Isa 66:7-8, 1 Thess 5:9-10, (Jude 1:14, Rev 19:14 saints coming back to earth), Rev 3:10, Rev 4:4, Rev 5:5, Rev 12:1-5

- Heb 13:8
The challenge (and the confusion) is in rightly dividing the word.

If we consider it from God's perspective, it is a one-time mass event. But it is not a one-time mass event from our worldly timeline, but rather as Paul explain, "each in his own order." Which cannot be corrected by other scriptures telling things from God's perspective. The only reconciliation of what would otherwise seem to contradict, is by rightly dividing the word into the correct context and perspective. If we speak of the rapture as it is experienced in the world, we must agree with Paul. But if we speak of the rapture as it pertains to the timeless realm of the kingdom of God, it is "together" "in the twinkling of an eye."
 

Copperhead

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Matt 24:31 is referring to the "great trump" which occurs at the end of the 70th week. Notice the word "loud" in Matt 24:31 is translated "great". The "last trump" in 1 Cor 15:52 and the "great trump" in Matt 24:31 are seven years apart. Also notice the word "gather" is translated "episunagó". This word is not a "harpazo". These are two different words with two different meanings.

That is true. The First Trump is an idiom for Pentacost / Feast of Weeks. The Last Trump, even during Paul's time, was an idiom for the Feast of Trumpets / Rosh Hashanah. The Great trumpet is an idiom for Day of Atonement / Yom Kippur. There are 7 days between Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur that correspond to the 70th week of Daniel.
 

Copperhead

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The challenge (and the confusion) is in rightly dividing the word.

If we consider it from God's perspective, it is a one-time mass event. But it is not a one-time mass event from our worldly timeline, but rather as Paul explain, "each in his own order." Which cannot be corrected by other scriptures telling things from God's perspective. The only reconciliation of what would otherwise seem to contradict, is by rightly dividing the word into the correct context and perspective. If we speak of the rapture as it is experienced in the world, we must agree with Paul. But if we speak of the rapture as it pertains to the timeless realm of the kingdom of God, it is "together" "in the twinkling of an eye."

Except "twinkling of an eye" is an idiom for Rosh Hashanah / Feast of Trumpets also. Right along with "last trump" being an idiom. Twinkling of an eye is when the last trump of the festival is blown.... when the last sliver of the setting sun on the 2nd day of the festival is seen. That last sliver of sun is called "twinkling of an eye".

And the entire festival, from beginning to end, comports with Yeshua's comment that no one knows the day or the hour. The idiom for the entire festival is "the day that no man knows".

I like to ponder dimensionality of time as much as anyone else, but it really doesn't fit with the idioms being used in scripture and the feasts they are associated with.
 

ScottA

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Except "twinkling of an eye" is an idiom for Rosh Hashanah / Feast of Trumpets also. Right along with "last trump" being an idiom. Twinkling of an eye is when the last trump of the festival is blown.... when the last sliver of the setting sun on the 2nd day of the festival is seen. That last sliver of sun is called "twinkling of an eye".

And the entire festival, from beginning to end, comports with Yeshua's comment that no one knows the day or the hour. The idiom for the entire festival is "the day that no man knows".

I like to ponder dimensionality of time as much as anyone else, but it really doesn't fit with the idioms being used in scripture and the feasts they are associated with.
It only fits if you rightly divide His word.

The "last trump" and "the end" are all the same timing, which is "in the twinkling of an eye" and is "at a day and hour which no one knows" (because it is our last hour in the world before we die) - the rapture, as it were.
 

Copperhead

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It only fits if you rightly divide His word.

The "last trump" and "the end" are all the same timing, which is "in the twinkling of an eye" and is "at a day and hour which no one knows" (because it is our last hour in the world before we die) - the rapture, as it were.

I worry sometimes about phrases put out like "rightly divide His word" since many will use that to shut down legitimate debate by insinuating they are dividing the word correctly and everyone else isn't. As if they have a personal pipeline to God's throne and speak for Him. Not saying you are in that camp, just stating an observation.

Last trump, twinkling of an eye, and day that no man knows are indeed the same timing, except that God has been a real stickler for Messianic happenings being associated with the feast days. That is why He called them Moedim (appointed times) and Miqra (rehearsals) in Leviticus 23.

There is nothing in scripture to associate these idioms or the feast they refer to as anything less than a corporate event. There is ample support in both OT and NT to associate them when the Feast of Trumpets. One would have to allegorize the scripture to extreme to have them apply on an individual basis.

If I misread and took your analysis wrong and you are associating the removal of the righteous with the Feast of Trumpets, then we would be in agreement. That feast, also called Yom Teruah, which also has in view "awakening blast", is associated with the resurrection as well as the removal of the righteous. Isaiah 26 is all about the Feast of Trumpets. "open the gates" from that passage is associated with the Feast. The gates are opened at Rosh Hashanah, and closed at Yom Kippur. The righteous are gathered into the gates at Rosh Hashanah, and those that did not repent during the interval between Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur, the gates are closed and their fate is sealed forever. In that same Isaiah passage, V19 on, the dead are risen and along with the righteous are hidden in chambers (see John 14:2) from the punishment coming upon the earth, that is designed to get Israel to recognize and call out for the Messiah (Hosea 5:15) and to drive people to repentance. And it is associated with Israel going into labor, V17, which Revelation 12 alludes to. That passage does mention a male child that is to rule with a rod of iron, and clearly means Messiah, but in Revelation 2:26-27, those that overcome also rule with a rod of iron along with Messiah. Revelation 12:5 therefore refers to the body of Messiah that is forcibly snatched up to God's throne, harpazo, in that verse. Yeshua was never forcibly snatched up at either His birth or His ascension.

Later, in Isaiah 27, a great trumpet is blown, V13. That is associated with Yom Kippur. The first trumpet is Pentacost (Shavuot or Feast of weeks), the last trumpet is Feast of trumpets (Yom Teruah), and the Great trumpet is Day of Atonement (Yom Kippur). The 7 days between Yom Teruah and Yom Kippur are called the "days of awe" and are associated with the 70th week of Daniel.
 
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Copperhead

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IF WE SHALL GO TO HEAVEN ONE DAY....
And if this is a fundamental plain teaching of the Bible, then surely we should be able to find many verses all over the Bible saying things such as: "When we get to heaven," "When we see each other in heaven," "They are up there in heaven with God," "We shall go to heaven at Christ's return," "We shall be in heaven where God is one day." BUT VERSES LIKE THIS CANNOT BE FOUND IN THE BIBLE!

In several passages of the OT. See above post for one of them.
 

ScottA

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I worry sometimes about phrases put out like "rightly divide His word" since many will use that to shut down legitimate debate by insinuating they are dividing the word correctly and everyone else isn't. As if they have a personal pipeline to God's throne and speak for Him. Not saying you are in that camp, just stating an observation.

Last trump, twinkling of an eye, and day that no man knows are indeed the same timing, except that God has been a real stickler for Messianic happenings being associated with the feast days. That is why He called them Moedim (appointed times) and Miqra (rehearsals) in Leviticus 23.

There is nothing in scripture to associate these idioms or the feast they refer to as anything less than a corporate event. There is ample support in both OT and NT to associate them when the Feast of Trumpets. One would have to allegorize the scripture to extreme to have them apply on an individual basis.

If I misread and took your analysis wrong and you are associating the removal of the righteous with the Feast of Trumpets, then we would be in agreement. That feast, also called Yom Teruah, which also has in view "awakening blast", is associated with the resurrection as well as the removal of the righteous. Isaiah 26 is all about the Feast of Trumpets. "open the gates" from that passage is associated with the Feast. The gates are opened at Rosh Hashanah, and closed at Yom Kippur. The righteous are gathered into the gates at Rosh Hashanah, and those that did not repent during the interval between Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur, the gates are closed and their fate is sealed forever. In that same Isaiah passage, V19 on, the dead are risen and along with the righteous are hidden in chambers (see John 14:2) from the punishment coming upon the earth, that is designed to get Israel to recognize and call out for the Messiah (Hosea 5:15) and to drive people to repentance. And it is associated with Israel going into labor, V17, which Revelation 12 alludes to. That passage does mention a male child that is to rule with a rod of iron, and clearly means Messiah, but in Revelation 2:26-27, those that overcome also rule with a rod of iron along with Messiah. Revelation 12:5 therefore refers to the body of Messiah that is forcibly snatched up to God's throne, harpazo, in that verse. Yeshua was never forcibly snatched up at either His birth or His ascension.

Later, in Isaiah 27, a great trumpet is blown, V13. That is associated with Yom Kippur. The first trumpet is Pentacost (Shavuot or Feast of weeks), the last trumpet is Feast of trumpets (Yom Teruah), and the Great trumpet is Day of Atonement (Yom Kippur). The 7 days between Yom Teruah and Yom Kippur are called the "days of awe" and are associated with the 70th week of Daniel.
That's fascinating. I marvel at the detail. Although I must confess, I am not wired in the way of the riddle, but rather in the way of its simpler translation. It is good to remember that "all things" of God that are public, whether created, written, or spoken, "come in parables."

As for rightly dividing the word, that divide is between God and men.
 

buddyt

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I've said this before and will continue to do so.
Rapture Mans dreamed up nonsense. To start look at Matthew 24 read with understanding. Jesus being asked the question when will all these things take place. When will you return ? The First words out of his mouth Take heed that No Man Deceive You. They shall deliver you up to be afflicted and shall kill you and ye shall be hated of all nations for my names sake. This doesn't sound like your going anywhere to me. For then shall be great tribulation such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time no nor ever shall be. And except those days should be shortened there should no flesh be saved but for the Elect's sake those days shall be shortened. Who are these Elect he speaks about ?

They surely aren't going anywhere sounds like they will be here to face the Wrath to me. It's truly a shame that Gods word is twisted to fit what Man would have it to be rather than to believe what He tells us. God knew of this Rapture thing coming that's why he told us in Ezekiel 13:20 how He felt about it. Do you believe GOD or do you believe man.

Nowhere in Gods word does he say hes going to remove anyone to the contrary he tells us what to expect. If you are contrary to the belief of a Rapture the first thing those who believe in this nonsense refer to is 1Thessalonians 4:13-18.Paul starts out telling where the dead are. He tells Jesus returns at the Trump of God that would be the 7th Trump spoken of in the book of Revelation. He ends in verse 18 saying Comfort one another knowing that the Dead are with Christ.
 
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Copperhead

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Well, I will admit that a rapture, on the surface, seems to be a preposterous idea. But then, so is quantum physics. Yet, just like quantum physics, that doesn't mean it isn't true.
 

Copperhead

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Nowhere in Gods word does he say hes going to remove anyone to the contrary he tells us what to expect. If you are contrary to the belief of a Rapture the first thing those who believe in this nonsense refer to is 1Thessalonians 4:13-18.Paul starts out telling where the dead are. He tells Jesus returns at the Trump of God that would be the 7th Trump spoken of in the book of Revelation. He ends in verse 18 saying Comfort one another knowing that the Dead are with Christ.

Paul had no idea about the 7 trumpets of Revelation, so could not have been referring to them. The revelation of the 7 trumpets was not given to Paul.

Revelation 1:1 (NKJV) The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show His servants—things which must shortly take place. And He sent and signified it by His angel to His servant John

The Father gave this information to Yeshua, who gave it to an angel, who gave it to John. The book wasn't out till around the 90's (per Iraneus who was a student of Polycarp, who was a student of John) and Paul was executed in the 60's.
 

n2thelight

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Paul had no idea about the 7 trumpets of Revelation, so could not have been referring to them. The revelation of the 7 trumpets was not given to Paul.

Revelation 1:1 (NKJV) The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show His servants—things which must shortly take place. And He sent and signified it by His angel to His servant John

The Father gave this information to Yeshua, who gave it to an angel, who gave it to John. The book wasn't out till around the 90's (per Iraneus who was a student of Polycarp, who was a student of John) and Paul was executed in the 60's.

How in the heck can people,especially rapturist say Paul don't know because his writings are at an earlier period,can you explain how the heck Daniel knew,when that book is almost an exact overly of Revelations
 
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Copperhead

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How in the heck can people,especially rapturist say Paul don't know because his writings are at an earlier period,can you explain how the heck Daniel knew,when that book is almost an exact overly of Revelations

How in the heck can people try to argue about what scripture says when they can't even understand basic reading comprehension?

Daniel didn't know about the 7 trumpets either. Daniel never made mention of the 7 trumpets. Paul never made mention of the 7 trumpets, just a last trumpet. And the 7 trumpets are not the only trumpets mentioned.

The only mention of a trumpet by Daniel was (in the ISV Bible), the trumpet blown when people were to bow to Nebuchudnezzer. You know... the event that got the three buddies of Daniel thrown into the furnace? You didn't even bother to look it up before you started chastising me? That speaks volumes right there. You just parroted what you had heard someone else say.

It doesn't get any clearer than Revelation 1:1. The details were given to Yeshua by the father. Yeshua then gave them to an angel to give to John. John wrote them down. Paul was never in the loop about those 7 trumpets.

The only trumpets regarding these sorts of things were the Feast trumpets which Paul had been taught extensively as a student of Gamliel as a Rabbi. The First Trumpet is associated with Shavuot / Pentacost. The Last Trumpet is associated with Rosh Hashanah / Feast of Trumpets. And the Great Trumpet is associated with Yom Kippur / Day of Atonement.