KJV Only...which one!

[JesusFan1]

Then it's impossible even to dialogue meaningfully, when such is the assumption.

NO christian church or scholar or theologian ever had the translation as being perfect, as they reserved that just towards the inspired originals!

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yes, anyone can say he is right when he is wrong. God knows the difference. Can we fix and convince anyone else whose heart is pointed the wrong way? Only if we are on God's side and He is using us in that way.

The man who is really hearing from God knows the difference. What man among us is to judge another ultimately? All we can do is follow God truly ourselves and teach others likewise.

"Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.
Be not wise in thine own eyes: fear the LORD, and depart from evil.
It shall be health to thy navel, and marrow to thy bones." Prov 3:5-8

You are not getting what I am saying.
Your original point was an appeal to God leading a man over what the Bible says because you said God will lead a person to figure out the correct interpretation even out of a poor translation.

Now, you are appealing to Scripture but it really does not connect in with your original point that God leads a person to find even a correct teaching within a poor translation. Proverbs 3:5-8 is simply telling us to trust in the Lord and not lean on our own understanding. How do we trust the Lord? Is it the Lord of our own imagination? Or is it by the Lord as described in Holy Scripture?

Psalms 119:42 says, “…I trust in thy word.”
How do you trust in His Word if it is corrupted?
The short answer is you cannot.

Also, what is the indications or qualifications that a person truly knows God? You really did not give an answer for this. Mormons believe in a burning of the bosom to confirm things spiritual.

We are told in Scripture:

“Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God:
because many false prophets are gone out into the world.” (1 John 4:1).

Not everyone preaches the same Jesus even.

“For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.” (2 Corinthians 11:4).

The qualifications in knowing the Lord is if we find we are keeping His commandments (See: 1 John 2:3).
The person who says they know the Lord and they don’t keep His commands is a liar and the truth is not in them (See 1 John 2:4).
How do we know about His commands if not by His Word (the Bible)?
Modern bibles actually change the commands of God and teach false doctrine (See post #458, post #459, post #460 for the list of changed doctrines; And see here for a list of commands changed in God’s Word).

Our carnal minds cannot accomplish God's right hand purpose for us or for others not even when we have the very best of Bibles as a source:
O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem 10:23

"Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled" Matt 5:

Here we go again.

You are appealing to something outside of Scripture as your source and then you quote Scripture to back up what you think supports your belief when in reality it is not really saying what you want it to say. God’s thoughts are not our thoughts.

“For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.” (Isaiah 55:8).

You quote Jeremiah 10:23 in that God will direct a man’s steps. But you don’t realize that Psalms 119:133 says this:

“Order my steps in thy word: and let not any iniquity have dominion over me.” (Psalms 119:133).

It is says that we are to order our steps according to God’s Word.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

There was NO need for any purification of the inspired books, as ALL of the 66 canon books were perfect when first penned down!

You are repeating what I already refuted.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

NO christian church or scholar or theologian ever had the translation as being perfect, as they reserved that just towards the inspired originals!

Again, you keep repeating a point you already stated that I explained. Why keep bringing up the same point repeatedly ad nauseam?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I have a perfect savior and Lord, and the Kjv, Nkjv, Nas, Esv, Niv ALL testify to Him!

No they don’t. Some Modern bibles falsely teach that Jesus is a created second God (i.e. the demi-god Jesus view) or they falsely teach Jesus had faith when this is not the case. Modern Bibles remove the one and only verse that clearly teaches the Trinity.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Kjvo assumes that the Greek TR, and the Kjv are both inerrant and perfexct!

It’s because we believe God’s Word. That’s why. God said the words of the Lord are pure words and they preserved forever (See: Psalms 12:6-7).
God made copies even with additional words added to the copy when the original manuscript (Scripture) was destroyed in Jeremiah 36. God did not keep the New Testament Scripture in the Old Hebrew, but God moved with the times and made the Scriptures available in the world language at that time (i.e. Koine Greek). God was able to translate at Pentecost various languages with no problems. So to be consistent with the character of God, we trust that there is a perfect Word today based on Scripture and how God operates. If you don’t believe such Scripture verses on the matter that is on you. Remember, faith comes by hearing, and hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17).

 

[Naomanos]

Why keep bringing up the same point repeatedly ad nauseam?

I generally wonder the same in regards to you.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

If you mean that the English corrects the Greek and Hebrew, this makes little sense.

One possibility is that the English says exactly the same thing as the originals. But if you know anything about languages sometimes words can either be lost in translation or words can be added so as to say the same thing.

We know in the book of Jeremiah that God told Jeremiah to make another copy of Scripture when king Jehoiakim had burned the original manuscript (or Scripture).

Jeremiah 36:28 says:
“Take thee again another roll, and write in it all the former words that were in the first roll, which Jehoiakim the king of Judah hath burned.”

But something amazing happened. The copy was not an exact replica. God added words to the copy.

Jeremiah 36:32
“Then took Jeremiah another roll, and gave it to Baruch the scribe, the son of Neriah; who wrote therein from the mouth of Jeremiah all the words of the book which Jehoiakim king of Judah had burned in the fire: and there were added besides unto them many like words.”

So God can edit His own Word when making a copy. It does not have to remain perfectly like the originals (if He so desires). So another possibility is that God may have slightly updated His words when He preserved them into the English. I am not diehard for whether God preserved the originals into English, or God slightly updated the originals with the English because we really cannot know that until the day we face God. What I do know is God preserved His words for us today based on what He says in Psalms 12:6-7.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I generally wonder the same in regards to you.

Blessings be unto you in the Lord.

 

[Naomanos]

Blessings be unto you in the Lord.

So, it's okay for you to do it, but not others. So it's okay that God changed words and added words to the KJV, but when it comes to modern versions, they are now corrupt according to you.

Talk about your double standards!

 

[Bible Highlighter]

So, it's okay for you to do it, but not others. So it's okay that God changed words and added words to the KJV, but when it comes to modern versions, they are now corrupt according to you.

Talk about your double standards!

They are words that are there but yet they are not there. Meaning the words in italics in the King James Bible are placed into italics to show the reader they are not a part of the original manuscripts that they worked off of but these words were added for the sentence to make any kind of sense because God is not the author of confusion. We see this elsewhere in Scripture of how God’s words are there and yet not there. I asked God for an example and He gave me Psalms 119:11. For you cannot see the words written on a person’s heart. Yet, those words are in the mind and seat of the emotions of that person who believes those words in Scripture. They are words that are there (in their heart and mind) and yet not there in the sense that you don’t actually see the words physically written in their inner being.

In short, the italicized words in the KJB are like words in brackets in the AMP Translation. They are merely added for clarity of the text.

God’s good ways be unto you in the Lord.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

That would be the originals!

That must be a sad world you’re in…

You have no pure Bible to fend off the Devil and to realize the pure uncorrupted gospel…

Yikes!

 

[farouk]

One possibility is that the English says exactly the same thing as the originals. But if you know anything about languages sometimes words can either be lost in translation or words can be added so as to say the same thing.

We know in the book of Jeremiah that God told Jeremiah to make another copy of Scripture when king Jehoiakim had burned the original manuscript (or Scripture).

Jeremiah 36:28 says:
“Take thee again another roll, and write in it all the former words that were in the first roll, which Jehoiakim the king of Judah hath burned.”

But something amazing happened. The copy was not an exact replica. God added words to the copy.

Jeremiah 36:32
“Then took Jeremiah another roll, and gave it to Baruch the scribe, the son of Neriah; who wrote therein from the mouth of Jeremiah all the words of the book which Jehoiakim king of Judah had burned in the fire: and there were added besides unto them many like words.”

So God can edit His own Word when making a copy. It does not have to remain perfectly like the originals (if He so desires). So another possibility is that God may have slightly updated His words when He preserved them into the English. I am not diehard for whether God preserved the originals into English, or God slightly updated the originals with the English because we really cannot know that until the day we face God. What I do know is God preserved His words for us today based on what He says in Psalms 12:6-7.

The Psalm 12 quote in question refers to people, in context. Various commentaries will attest this.

 

[amadeus]

You are not getting what I am saying.
Your original point was an appeal to God leading a man over what the Bible says because you said God will lead a person to figure out the correct interpretation even out of a poor translation.

Now, you are appealing to Scripture but it really does not connect in with your original point that God leads a person to find even a correct teaching within a poor translation. Proverbs 3:5-8 is simply telling us to trust in the Lord and not lean on our own understanding. How do we trust the Lord? Is it the Lord of our own imagination? Or is the Lord as described in Holy Scripture?

Psalms 119:42 says, “…I trust in thy word.”
How do you trust in His Word if it is corrupted?
The short answer is you cannot.

Also, what is the indications or qualifications that a person truly knows God? You really did not give an answer for this. Mormons believe in a burning of the bosom to confirm things spiritual.

We are told in Scripture:

“Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God:
because many false prophets are gone out into the world.” (1 John 4:1).

Not everyone preaches the same Jesus even.

“For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.” (2 Corinthians 11:4).

The qualifications in knowing the Lord is if we find we are keeping His commandments (See: 1 John 2:3).
The person who says they know the Lord and they don’t keep His commands is a liar and the truth is not in them (See 1 John 2:4).
How do we know about His commands if not by His Word (the Bible)?
Modern bibles actually change the commands of God and teach false doctrine (See post #458, post #459, post #460 for the list of changed doctrines; And see here for a list of commands changed in God’s Word).



Here we go again.

You are appealing to something outside of Scripture as your source and then you quote Scripture to back up what you think supports your belief when in reality it is not really saying what you want it to say. God’s thoughts are not our thoughts.

“For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.” (Isaiah 55:8).

You quote Jeremiah 10:23 in that God will direct a man’s steps. But you don’t realize that Psalms 119:133 says this:

“Order my steps in thy word: and let not any iniquity have dominion over me.” (Psalms 119:133).

It is says that we are to order our steps according to God’s Word.

This is why you see me so seldom involved in the discussions or debates or arguments here. I read and study my Bibles, which in English means for me the KJV. [I also read my Bible regularly in Spanish and German.]

My communication with God however cannot be carnal alone. It must not be. Babies are allowed to babble and they are loved and helped to grow, learning to understand and to speak in a better way.

For me, as I see it, the Bible is an empty shell [like the dead unresurrected body of Jesus on the cross] without the quickening Spirit.

Satan tried to use quotations from the written scriptures to defeat Jesus. Of course, he failed. [Matt 4:1ff] The difference was not in the black and white written words, but in the power within the Word spoken by Jesus and the lack thereof in Satan. Satan quoted Psalm 91 and Jesus quoted Deut. 6. Atheists try to do that. Believers also do that at times using the logical conclusions of their carnal minds.

Both Paul and James warn us against double-mindedness. Where does one receive the power to overcome that if not from the Holy Spirit?

 

[Naomanos]

They are words that are there but yet they are not there. Meaning the words in italics in the King James Bible are placed into italics to show the reader they are not a part of the original manuscripts that they worked off of but these words were added for the sentence to make any kind of sense because God is not the author of confusion. We see this elsewhere in Scripture of how God’s words are there and yet not there. I asked God for an example and He gave me Psalms 119:11. For you cannot see the words written on a person’s heart. Yet, those words are in the mind and seat of the emotions of that person who believes those words in Scripture. They are words that are there (in their heart and mind) and yet not there in the sense that you don’t actually see the words physically written in their inner being.

In short, the italicized words in the KJB are like words in brackets in the AMP Translation. They are merely added for clarity of the text.

God’s good ways be unto you in the Lord.

You completely missed the point of my post. I'm not talking about italicized words.

You have a double standard.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The Psalm 12 quote in question refers to people, in context. Various commentaries will attest this.

Some KJB Only Christians like David Cloud believes this is in reference to both God’s words and God’s people. But I don’t get that indication from reading the King James Bible. Generally Modern Bibles favor the God’s people being preserved (instead of God’s words being preserved) rendering. But even if you wanted to argue otherwise, the Bible teaches elsewhere that His words will be preserved forever.

Psalms 100:5 -
“For the LORD is good, his mercy is everlasting; and his truth endureth to all generations.”

Supporting Verse for Psalms 100:5:

John 17:17 -
“Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.”​

1 Peter 1:23-25 -
“Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. For all flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away: But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.”

Isaiah 40:8 -
“The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: but the word of our God shall stand for ever.”

Matthew 24:35 -
“Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.”

Also, are commentators our word of authority or way of understanding the Bible? I really stopped reading commentators a long while back because they said things many times that ran contrary to Scripture or they did not say things clearly. Read 1 John 2:27. We should read the Bible for ourselves and ask God for the understanding and compare Scripture with Scripture (reading the context). We should let Scripture speak for itself instead of us seeking a man’s interpretation.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You completely missed the point of my post. I'm not talking about italicized words.

You have a double standard.

What words do you think the KJB adds then? The Textus Receptus was the accepted majority Greek manuscripts long before the Westcott and Hort Greek Critical Text came on to the scene way later. Just because the Revisers claim the Vaticanus and Sinaiticus is older and better does not mean that it actually is better or older. Those are just their claims. The real proof in the pudding is looking at the doctrines when we compare the KJB vs. Modern Bibles. Besides, they really are not following the Vaticanus, and Sinaiticus strictly today anyways. They look also to other Alexandrian manuscripts, and the text keeps changing (Meaning more words are added, changed or removed, etcetera).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

This is why you see me so seldom involved in the discussions or debates or arguments here. I read and study my Bibles, which in English means for me the KJV. [I also read my Bible regularly in Spanish and German.]

My communication with God however cannot be carnal alone. It must not be. Babies are allowed to babble and they are loved and helped to grow, learning to understand and to speak in a better way.

For me, as I see it, the Bible is an empty shell [like the dead unresurrected body of Jesus on the cross] without the quickening Spirit.

Satan tried to use quotations from the written scriptures to defeat Jesus. Of course, he failed. [Matt 4:1ff] The difference was not in the black and white written words, but in the power within the Word spoken by Jesus and the lack thereof in Satan. Satan quoted Psalm 91 and Jesus quoted Deut. 6. Atheists try to do that. Believers also do that at times using the logical conclusions of their carnal minds.

Both Paul and James warn us against double-mindedness. Where does one receive the power to overcome that if not from the Holy Spirit?

Wow. You call the Bible an empty shell. Yet, you quote from it as if to support your claims.
Jesus said His words are spirit and they are life.
Peter said that Jesus had the words of everlasting life.
What was the seed in the parable of the sower according to the Bible?
Romans 10:17 basically says faith comes by hearing the Word of God.
So you would not even have faith if it was not for the Bible.
You would not know about Jesus and salvation in Him today if it was not for the Bible.

 

[Jim B]

Not true. I already demonstrated that Modern bibles teach false doctrines, etcetera.

But your demonstration has no merit. Your statement that "Modern (capitalized?) bibles teach false doctrines, etcetera" is meaningless. Not only is this a false statement but you fail to give any examples of why you believe it.

If the olde King James translation is so perfect, why don't you read/write/speak in early 17th century Englyshe? Don't you want to be clearly understood?

P.S. How is your unicorn doing? "God brought them out of Egypt; he hath as it were the strength of an unicorn." Numbers 23:22 KJV

 

[Bible Highlighter]

But your demonstration has no merit. Your statement that "Modern (capitalized?) bibles teach false doctrines, etcetera" is meaningless. Not only is this a false statement but you fail to give any examples of why you believe it.

Not at all. I have already demonstrated this.

Modern bibles actually change the commands of God and teach false doctrine (See post #458, post #459, post #460 for the list of changed doctrines; And see here for a list of commands changed in God’s Word).

If the olde King James translation is so perfect, why don't you read/write/speak in early 17th century Englyshe? Don't you want to be clearly understood?

The same reason Jesus spoke in parables and for the same reason Jesus spoke cryptically of His death and resurrection with His disciples vs. spelling it out for them clearly what was about to happen with hand puppets.

P.S. How is your unicorn doing?
God brought them out of Egypt; he hath as it were the strength of an unicorn." Numbers 23:22 KJV

While it is possible that there are one horned horses that died out, or the one horned aurochs (bulls), unicorns can also simply be in reference to any one horned animal, too.

Here is a Science book on unicorns.

https://www.amazon.com/Natural-History-Unicorns-Chris-Lavers-ebook/dp/B002M41TTI/