You guys have to start praying for two things: the rapture of the faith (that it be great) and deliverance from the tribulation (that it not spread)

[Gottservant]

What, pray that Lord Jesus will mysteriously CHANGE... what HE SAID WILL HAPPEN at the end of this world??

It sounds like you have your mind made up to NOT LISTEN TO LORD JESUS IN HIS WORD about the SIGNS He gave about the end.

I'm not sure why you are getting worked up? Did Jesus get worked up when He asked you to pray?

If I had a mind that I could keep made up, I would make it made up concerning "you who hear, will be given more" (Mark 4:24, from memory)

Really, brother, as you approach the Tribulation, was it really so strange that a brother of yours, should ask you to start praying?

Did Jesus not ask the disciples to pray in the Garden of Gethsemane?

 

[VCO]

I'm not sure why you are getting worked up? Did Jesus get worked up when He asked you to pray?

If I had a mind that I could keep made up, I would make it made up concerning "you who hear, will be given more" (Mark 4:24, from memory)

Really, brother, as you approach the Tribulation, was it really so strange that a brother of yours, should ask you to start praying?

Did Jesus not ask the disciples to pray in the Garden of Gethsemane?

Do you know WHY I believe it has to be Pre-Trib, that true Believers has to be Raptured? It says so in these verses:


Revelation 4:1-4 (HCSB)
1 After this I looked, and there in heaven was an open door. The first voice that I had heard speaking to me like a trumpet said, “Come up here, and I will show you what must take place after this.”
2 Immediately I was in the Spirit, and a throne was set there in heaven. One was seated on the throne,
3 and the One seated looked like jasper and carnelian stone. A rainbow that looked like an emerald surrounded the throne.
4 Around that throne were 24 thrones, and on the thrones sat 24 elders dressed in white clothes, with gold crowns on their heads.

John SAW them Sitting there! Which would have to be after the Rapture, and we go as to heaven as a GROUP, and therefore they had legs to sit on.

 

[Davy]

I thank my Father every day for every day.

I will leave his prophetic timetables to He who knows more than I. Amen.

If you're not paying attention to Christ's and His Apostle's warning SIGNS about the end of this world that are given to His Church, then don't expect to be blessed by Him.

Rev 1:1-3
The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto His servants things which must shortly come to pass; and He sent and signified it by His angel unto His servant John:

2 Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.

3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.
KJV

 

[Davy]

I'm not sure why you are getting worked up? Did Jesus get worked up when He asked you to pray?

Quit trying to change the subject.

Tell me exactly WHY... you are determined to NOT pay attention to the SIGNS of the end that Lord Jesus and His Apostles gave us to be watching?

I can guess why (because of you're heeding doctrines of men instead, and a particular doctrine from men at that), but I want to hear you say it.

 

[Jay Ross]

Oh dear, Jesus did warn the people of His day that those who try to save themselves from the calamity that will come during the End Times will actually die the second death. The supposed near future Pre-trib rapture is what many hope will save them from the pain and suffering for their belief in Christ.

Seems like many ignore those words from Christ.

 

[BlessedPeace]

We're not told to look for the Antichrist. Were told to look for the return of Jesus.

I think we fear the tribulation and Antichrist overmuch. I don't think our focus should be on the world's chaos, wondering if this is the end. Praying for that even, as some may do.

Instead I think accepting God telling us everything happens as He wills in it's own time, is wise. And brings peace to our hearts.

Just my thoughts.

 

[Gottservant]

Quit trying to change the subject.

Tell me exactly WHY... you are determined to NOT pay attention to the SIGNS of the end that Lord Jesus and His Apostles gave us to be watching?

I can guess why (because of you're heeding doctrines of men instead, and a particular doctrine from men at that), but I want to hear you say it.

I'm not changing the subject: now is the time to pray.

You don't seem to understand the meaning of the word "now"?

What "sign" did Jesus say exempted disciples from praying? Really?

 

[Davy]

We're not told to look for the Antichrist. Were told to look for the return of Jesus.

You are terribly... wrong on that. The main reason why Lord Jesus WARNED you about the coming false-Christ in His Olivet discourse is so you would NOT be deceived! That is why He 'commanded' us to WATCH those SIGNS of the end He gave us.

But I well know just who is telling you NOT to WATCH. It's the devils behind the false Pre-trib Rapture Theory that are telling you that. Anyone heeding those men are NOT heeding Christ's WARNINGS.

And not only did Lord Jesus give us the WARNING about the coming false-Christ to Jerusalem, but so did Apostle Paul in 2 Corinthians 11, and 2 Thessalonians 2. And in Revelation 9 thru 17, Lord Jesus gave us even more DETAIL about the SIGNS of that coming Antichrist for the end, so that those who claim to belong to Jesus have NO EXCUSE.

Isa 42:9
9 Behold, the former things are come to pass, and new things do I declare: before they spring forth I tell you of them.
KJV

 

[VCO]

I'm not changing the subject: now is the time to pray.

You don't seem to understand the meaning of the word "now"?

What "sign" did Jesus say exempted disciples from praying? Really?

But you seem to think you, We All need to offer prayers, as if GOD has not made up HIS mind when the Rapture will be?

Isaiah 46:10 (HCSB)
10 I declare the end from the beginning, and from long ago what is not yet done, saying:
My plan will take place, and I will do all My will.

 

[Gottservant]

But you seem to think you, We All need to offer prayers, as if GOD has not made up HIS mind when the Rapture will be?

Jesus said pray. What is it to you, if you pray but the time (you were praying for) was another?

 

[BlessedPeace]

But you seem to think you, We All need to offer prayers, as if GOD has not made up HIS mind when the Rapture will be?

Isaiah 46:10 (HCSB)
10 I declare the end from the beginning, and from long ago what is not yet done, saying:
My plan will take place, and I will do all My will.

I agree with this.

If I pray for such things as the rapture then by association I am praying the great tribulation occurs. And am also telling the Father I am impatient with his timetable.

 

[Gottservant]

I agree with this.

If I pray for such things as the rapture then by association I am praying the great tribulation occurs. And am also telling the Father I am impatient with his timetable.

If you will not pray, because you do not think now is the time, when do you think the time will be and what will you pray when it is time?

 

[BlessedPeace]

If you will not pray, because you do not think now is the time, when do you think the time will be and what will you pray when it is time?

I don't believe I will need to pray then. I'll instead be listening to my Father welcoming us home.

 

[Gottservant]

Jesus said "everyone will be tested with fire" at some point, praying that you escape and be with the Lord will be true.

Either I pray now and am tested and survive, or I am tested and I wish I prayed.

You can't see that this is good for you?

 

[VCO]

Jesus said pray. What is it to you, if you pray but the time (you were praying for) was another?

Not only This verse:

Isaiah 46:10 (HCSB)
10 I declare the end from the beginning, and from long ago what is not yet done, saying:
My plan will take place, and I will do all My will.

Numbers 33:56 (NIV)
56 And then I will do to you what I plan to do to them.'"

Proverbs 14:22 (NCV)
22 Those who make evil plans will be ruined, but those who plan to do good will be loved and trusted.

Psalm 120:3 (NCV)
3 You who plan evil, what will God do to you? How will he punish you?

 

[rebuilder 454]

Lord Jesus already showed me the 'narrow path' PER HIS WRITTEN WORD. That is what I go by. And He revealed all... the SIGNS necessary for us to know leading up to His future return. Included in that is for His 'faithful' servants to PREPARE their hearts and minds to make a STAND DURING THE COMING TRIBULATION FOR HIM, to give a TESTIMONY for Him by The Holy Spirit.

So you want to talk about prayer so The Holy Spirit can revel His purpose for us in these times and in the coming tribulation? Then STUDY your Bible like I suggested and do not rely on your own speculations, which is mostly what your post suggests. Prayer for today is NOT to remove the coming tribulation upon the saints for the end, because God has ordained it. So it's not about praying to try to remove it, nor to escape it with a pre-trib rapture theory of man!
See Mark 13 if you don't know about being delivered up to give a TESTIMONY for Jesus during the coming tribulation.

Lol
The bible says all take the mark. Every man woman and child.
You either take it or die.
Nothing you said is correct.

 

[rebuilder 454]

And I'm asking you... to get into your Bible more, asking our Heavenly Father and His Son for greater understanding, and thus be listening and heeding Him to be prepared for what's coming in the end of this world, and not relying on your 'own' thinking, and certainly not on a bunch of one-verse preachers whom God did not call to be teachers.

...and yet you have ignored the pretrib rapture verses

 

[rebuilder 454]

How do you know that The Holy Spirit hasn't ALREADY shown me what to expect and how to act during the coming "great tribulation" upon Christ's Church? He does that by one following HIS WORD OF TRUTH IN THE BIBLE. You did know that The Bible was given by The Holy Spirit, didn't you?

So you creating such FALSE ideas like someone who disagrees with YOUR ideology are treating YOUR faith as an obstacle is truly funny! There's just no fake psychological ploy someone like you won't try!

I hope he "showed " you everyone on the planet, save the jews , takes the mark or dies.
The trib is JACOBS TROUBLE.
Church age ends.
God shifts to the Jews.

 

[rebuilder 454]

You need to read your Bible more instead of listening to rogue preachers preach their own word.

Firstly, there is NO SUCH THING AS A PRE-TRIBULATIONAL RAPTURE written of in God's Word. Instead, Jesus showed in Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27 that His coming to gather His saints is AFTER... the tribulation of those days. The whole Church still alive on earth WILL GO THROUGH THE GREAT TRIBULATION.

Furthermore, Lord Jesus commanded His servants to WATCH the Signs of the end He gave leading up to His future return! And He specifically GAVE INSTRUCTIONS TO HIS ELECT THAT ARE DELIVERED UP TO COUNCILS AND SYNAGOGUES TO GIVE A TESTIMONY FOR HIM BY THE HOLY SPIRIT!

And lastly, the 'heavenly dimension' is going to be REVEALED RIGHT HERE ON EARTH. When Jesus gathers His FAITHFUL Church, it is only in order to go WITH HIM TO JERUSALEM, ON EARTH. Zechariah 14 TELLS YOU where Jesus' feet will touch down again upon this earth! and that is where God's Word shows He brings His faithful Church with Him to! STUDY IT or be lost!

You omit the pretrib rapture verses, then try to prove postrib rapture.
Typical postrib talking points CENTERED in omissions.

 

[VCO]

You omit the pretrib rapture verses, then try to prove postrib rapture.
Typical postrib talking points CENTERED in omissions.

YES! And they take verses the WRONG way, like these verses:

Matthew 25:1-13 (NCV)
1 "At that time the kingdom of heaven will be like ten bridesmaids who took their lamps and went to wait for the bridegroom.
2 Five of them were foolish and five were wise.
3 The five foolish bridesmaids took their lamps, but they did not take more oil for the lamps to burn.
4 The wise bridesmaids took their lamps and more oil in jars.
5 Because the bridegroom was late, they became sleepy and went to sleep.
6 “At midnight someone cried out, ’The bridegroom is coming! Come and meet him!’
7 Then all the bridesmaids woke up and got their lamps ready.
8 But the foolish ones said to the wise, ’Give us some of your oil, because our lamps are going out.’
9 The wise bridesmaids answered, ’No, the oil we have might not be enough for all of us. Go to the people who sell oil and buy some for yourselves.’
10 “So while the five foolish bridesmaids went to buy oil, the bridegroom came. The bridesmaids who were ready went in with the bridegroom to the wedding feast. Then the door was closed and locked.
11 “Later the others came back and said, ’Sir, sir, open the door to let us in.’
12 But the bridegroom answered, ’I tell you the truth, I don’t want to know you.’
13 “So always be ready,
because you don’t know the day or the hour the Son of Man will come.

It is important that HE is called Son of Man, HE comes as Son of Man, before HE comes as KING of Kings.
HE stops at in the Clouds, on that TRIP.