Tradition Versus Scripture

[Bibleinvestigations]

Hello everyone, I’ve now been kicked off three forums because of this subject. I’m a 100% believer in Jesus through scripture, and a nonbeliever in tradition? Why? Because for three years I have conducted very detailed investigations into scripture and proved to myself that the Gospels are eyewitness accounts. Why zero confidence in tradition? Because the investigations proved tradition to be false and 1 John 2:18-19, among other scripture, tells the church not to trust it. Will I be kicked off again or are there interested Christians and seekers of the truth willing to have a logical and facts based discussion on my results that counter “commonly accepted theology” or CAT? I keep running across Christians who can’t seem to realize that a person can 100% believe in scripture to be a dedicated follower of Jesus, while rejecting CAT As false teaching.

Blessings, jaz

 

[Keturah]

Welcome to CB and luck in your endeavors to find IT any different here.

*** Abiding by the rules of the forum will keep your stay here in a more secured position.

 

[Angelina]

Hi @Bibleinvestigations! Welcome to Christianity Board. Please read the forum rules which is found in the announcement section here - Community Announcements This ensures that you are not breaching any rules.

I only became familiar with CAT while joining this forum otherwise, I wouldn't know half of the accepted beliefs that various denominations hold to, nor do I understand much of it. Welcome again...

 

[Aunty Jane]

Hello everyone, I’ve now been kicked off three forums because of this subject. I’m a 100% believer in Jesus through scripture, and a nonbeliever in tradition? Why? Because for three years I have conducted very detailed investigations into scripture and proved to myself that the Gospels are eyewitness accounts. Why zero confidence in tradition? Because the investigations proved tradition to be false and 1 John 2:18-19, among other scripture, tells the church not to trust it. Will I be kicked off again or are there interested Christians and seekers of the truth willing to have a logical and facts based discussion on my results that counter “commonly accepted theology” or CAT? I keep running across Christians who can’t seem to realize that a person can 100% believe in scripture to be a dedicated follower of Jesus, while rejecting CAT As false teaching.

Blessings, jaz

Jesus didn't have much time for the traditions of the Pharisees.....

Matt 15:1-3...
"Then there came to Jesus from Jerusalem Pharisees and scribes, saying: 2 “Why do your disciples overstep the tradition of the men of former times? For example, they do not wash their hands when about to eat a meal.
3 In reply he said to them: “Why do you overstep the commandment of God because of your tradition?"

John 15:7-10...
"You hypocrites, Isaiah aptly prophesied about you when he said: 8 ‘This people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far removed from me. 9 It is in vain that they keep worshipping me, for they teach commands of men as doctrines.’”

Traditions are merely the commands of men...if it isn't in the Bible reject it.....right?

 

[Bibleinvestigations]

Jesus didn't have much time for the traditions of the Pharisees.....

Matt 15:1-3...
"Then there came to Jesus from Jerusalem Pharisees and scribes, saying: 2 “Why do your disciples overstep the tradition of the men of former times? For example, they do not wash their hands when about to eat a meal.
3 In reply he said to them: “Why do you overstep the commandment of God because of your tradition?"

John 15:7-10...
"You hypocrites, Isaiah aptly prophesied about you when he said: 8 ‘This people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far removed from me. 9 It is in vain that they keep worshipping me, for they teach commands of men as doctrines.’”

Traditions are merely the commands of men...if it isn't in the Bible reject it.....right?

Yes you are so right!! The problem with the work the Lord has me doing in scripture is that there is obvious tradition and there is imbedded tradition. For example, many hold the gospel author names as something that is indisputable, however it is tradition. I don’t want to publicize me, the investigations I’ve completed, or the books I’ve been asked to write, but the Lord has had me using my background and expertise to investigate tradition to find the truth. The truth is that the Gospels are eyewitness testimony and Jesus is the son of God. Does it matter whether the Gospels have been misnamed or not? It does if it was intentional and that is the message I’ve been asked to share. No speculation or opinions; just a data based scripture finding and discussion.

I get kicked off because even though most Christians pray to God for intervention, when I report that God is working wonderful things in my life, somehow that becomes offensive. Also, concluding in these investigations as I have that the Gospel authors have been misnamed, somehow makes me a heretic - even though my results prove the story of Jesus as true, turned me from a doubter to a fully dedicated follower and promoter of Jesus, and provided names of authors who are more believable than the accepTed tradition.

 

[Bibleinvestigations]

Hi @Bibleinvestigations! Welcome to Christianity Board. Please read the forum rules which is found in the announcement section here - Community Announcements This ensures that you are not breaching any rules.

I only became familiar with CAT while joining this forum otherwise, I wouldn't know half of the accepted beliefs that various denominations hold to, nor do I understand much of it. Welcome again...

Thank you for you kind welcome. Jesus commanded against tradition in the church and the disciples extensively wrote that tradition, also called untrue stories, heresy, and fables, is from false teachers. 1 John 2:18-19 is the prime evidence of it’s early and profound intrusion into the church. Yet many who are in the church today hold tradition in such high esteem as though it is the word of God, that they resort to name calling, accusations of blasphemy and atheism. They resort to eliminating the threat to their false beliefs by throwing me out without warning.

 

[Bibleinvestigations]

Yes you are so right!! The problem with the work the Lord has me doing in scripture is that there is obvious tradition and there is imbedded tradition. For example, many hold the gospel author names as something that is indisputable, however it is tradition. I don’t want to publicize me, the investigations I’ve completed, or the books I’ve been asked to write, but the Lord has had me using my background and expertise to investigate tradition to find the truth. The truth is that the Gospels are eyewitness testimony and Jesus is the son of God. Does it matter whether the Gospels have been misnamed or not? It does if it was intentional and that is the message I’ve been asked to share. No speculation or opinions; just a data based scripture finding and discussion.

I get kicked off because even though most Christians pray to God for intervention, when I report that God is working wonderful things in my life, somehow that becomes offensive. Also, concluding in these investigations as I have that the Gospel authors have been misnamed, somehow makes me a heretic - even though my results prove the story of Jesus as true, turned me from a doubter to a fully dedicated follower and promoter of Jesus, and provided names of authors who are more believable than the accepTed tradition.

Sorry this response was meant for Angelina. I’m still getting used to this site.

 

[GRACE ambassador]

Hello everyone, I’ve now been kicked off three forums because of this subject. CAT?

Precious friend, A Very Warm Welcome to the Board.

Correct, any oral tradition cannot, by religion, be made equal to God's Pure and Preserved
Word Of Truth, Which "He Has MAGNIFIED Above All His Holy Name" (Psalms 12:6-7; 138:2)
Amen?

Please Be Very RICHLY Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, And Edified In
The LORD JESUS CHRIST, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided! (+ I and II!) * ← PG rated "Approved" *
↑ still learning even after 33 years of study ↑ ♫ ↑

Grace, Peace, And JOY!…

* PG = Perfect God / Parental Guidance:

 

[ScottA]

Hello everyone, I’ve now been kicked off three forums because of this subject. I’m a 100% believer in Jesus through scripture, and a nonbeliever in tradition? Why? Because for three years I have conducted very detailed investigations into scripture and proved to myself that the Gospels are eyewitness accounts. Why zero confidence in tradition? Because the investigations proved tradition to be false and 1 John 2:18-19, among other scripture, tells the church not to trust it. Will I be kicked off again or are there interested Christians and seekers of the truth willing to have a logical and facts based discussion on my results that counter “commonly accepted theology” or CAT? I keep running across Christians who can’t seem to realize that a person can 100% believe in scripture to be a dedicated follower of Jesus, while rejecting CAT As false teaching.

Blessings, jaz

Welcome jaz!

Indeed, a time was to come and has come, that "those who worship Him (God) must worship in spirit and truth." Destructive doctrines and the teachings of men, and the believing of lies by false teachers which were foretold to enter into the church, have done so causing strong delusion and great apostacy; and yet we also have the promise from Christ that we are to be lead unto all truth, a time foretold as preceding the sounding of the seventh angel. These have been and now are the times foretold.

While many yet slumber, a great awakening is upon us. Be bold, speaking the things of God rather than of men.

 

[Bibleinvestigations]

Precious friend, A Very Warm Welcome to the Board.

Correct, any oral tradition cannot, by religion, be made equal to God's Pure and Preserved
Word Of Truth, Which "He Has MAGNIFIED Above All His Holy Name" (Psalms 12:6-7; 138:2)
Amen?

Please Be Very RICHLY Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, And Edified In
The LORD JESUS CHRIST, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided! (+ I and II!) * ← PG rated "Approved" *
↑ still learning even after 33 years of study ↑ ♫ ↑

Grace, Peace, And JOY!…

* PG = Perfect God / Parental Guidance:

View attachment 33933

Amen. I read all of Psalm 12 and it destroys any notion that tradition is allowed to be mixed in with the word of God. I love your statement that you are still learning after 33 years! I’ll bet it’s all scripture too. I don’t need other books because there are so many things to learn from scripture that I don’t have any spare time!! Thanks for enlightening me with the Psalm reference because it’s been a long time since I’ve been in that book.

 

[Bibleinvestigations]

Precious friend, A Very Warm Welcome to the Board.

Correct, any oral tradition cannot, by religion, be made equal to God's Pure and Preserved
Word Of Truth, Which "He Has MAGNIFIED Above All His Holy Name" (Psalms 12:6-7; 138:2)
Amen?

Please Be Very RICHLY Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, And Edified In
The LORD JESUS CHRIST, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided! (+ I and II!) * ← PG rated "Approved" *
↑ still learning even after 33 years of study ↑ ♫ ↑

Grace, Peace, And JOY!…

* PG = Perfect God / Parental Guidance:

View attachment 33933

Welcome jaz!

Indeed, a time was to come and has come, that "those who worship Him (God) must worship in spirit and truth." Destructive doctrines and the teachings of men, and the believing of lies by false teachers which were foretold to enter into the church, have done so causing strong delusion and great apostacy; and yet we also have the promise from Christ that we are to be lead unto all truth, a time foretold as preceding the sounding of the seventh angel. These have been and now are the times foretold.

While many yet slumber, a great awakening is upon us. Be bold, speaking the things of God rather than of men.

Thanks ScottA, most in the church do not realize just how deep tradition has infested the word. It seems like you do. Blessings!!

 

[Mjh29]

Hello everyone, I’ve now been kicked off three forums because of this subject. I’m a 100% believer in Jesus through scripture, and a nonbeliever in tradition? Why? Because for three years I have conducted very detailed investigations into scripture and proved to myself that the Gospels are eyewitness accounts. Why zero confidence in tradition? Because the investigations proved tradition to be false and 1 John 2:18-19, among other scripture, tells the church not to trust it. Will I be kicked off again or are there interested Christians and seekers of the truth willing to have a logical and facts based discussion on my results that counter “commonly accepted theology” or CAT? I keep running across Christians who can’t seem to realize that a person can 100% believe in scripture to be a dedicated follower of Jesus, while rejecting CAT As false teaching.

Blessings, jaz

Bahnsen does an excellent job of dealing with the problems inherent in tradition. Thought you might be interested!

 

[Matthias]

Hello everyone, I’ve now been kicked off three forums because of this subject. I’m a 100% believer in Jesus through scripture, and a nonbeliever in tradition? Why? Because for three years I have conducted very detailed investigations into scripture and proved to myself that the Gospels are eyewitness accounts. Why zero confidence in tradition? Because the investigations proved tradition to be false and 1 John 2:18-19, among other scripture, tells the church not to trust it. Will I be kicked off again or are there interested Christians and seekers of the truth willing to have a logical and facts based discussion on my results that counter “commonly accepted theology” or CAT? I keep running across Christians who can’t seem to realize that a person can 100% believe in scripture to be a dedicated follower of Jesus, while rejecting CAT As false teaching.

Blessings, jaz

Welcome to the forums.

What are you thoughts on 2 Thessalonians 2:15?

”So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught, whether by word of mouth or by letter from us.” (NASB)

 

[Matthias]

Growing up, my daughter attended a church youth group which ended every meeting with a tradition. The leader of the group led the children in reciting Numbers 6:24-25.

”May the LORD bless you and protect you.
May the LORD smile on you and be gracious to you.”

Problem or not a problem with this particular youth group’s tradition?

 

[Bibleinvestigations]

T

Bahnsen does an excellent job of dealing with the problems inherent in tradition. Thought you might be interested!

Thank you very much!! I listened to some of the first video and since I am on the road in a few days I will listen to the rest. It’s a very interesting discussion and I was impressed with Dr. Bahnsen so I wrote him to try to share some data. If I hear back I’ll update this posting. Thanks again and God Bless.

 

[Mjh29]

T

Thank you very much!! I listened to some of the first video and since I am on the road in a few days I will listen to the rest. It’s a very interesting discussion and I was impressed with Dr. Bahnsen so I wrote him to try to share some data. If I hear back I’ll update this posting. Thanks again and God Bless.

I’m really glad you enjoyed it! Unfortunately, Bahnsen himself has since this was recorded passed on - but he has written many books and other resources on things such as tradition vs scripture and even apologetics, if you’re interested I could give you some titles! Bahnsen is one of my personal favorites, so I’m glad to hear someone else enjoying his work as well!

 

[Bibleinvestigations]

Welcome to the forums.

What are you thoughts on 2 Thessalonians 2:15?

”So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught, whether by word of mouth or by letter from us.” (NASB)

Paul is clearly referencing past (you were taught) lessons delivered by the apostles (whether by word of mouth or by letter). Considering this with all the warnings about false teachers in scripture together with 1 John 2:18-19, I only trust the word of God as coming from the eyewitnesses of Jesus and the apostles.

 

[Matthias]

Did Jesus himself observe any traditions?

Did Jesus Participate in Repetitious Rituals and Traditions?

Circumcision of Christ, Menologion of Basil II, 979-984 Rituals are defined as religious or solemn ceremonies consisting of a series of actions performed according to a prescribed order. These…

theoldfulfilled.wordpress.com

 

[Bibleinvestigations]

I’m really glad you enjoyed it! Unfortunately, Bahnsen himself has since this was recorded passed on - but he has written many books and other resources on things such as tradition vs scripture and even apologetics, if you’re interested I could give you some titles! Bahnsen is one of my personal favorites, so I’m glad to hear someone else enjoying his work as well!

Sorry to hear that - maybe someone is carrying on his work at his institute. Thanks for the offer for more titles, but I’m currently working full time for the Lord and as much as I’d like to read more of Bahnsen’s work, I wouldn’t get to it for long time.

 

[Matthias]

Paul is clearly referencing past (you were taught) lessons delivered by the apostles (whether by word of mouth or by letter). Considering this with all the warnings about false teachers in scripture together with 1 John 2:18-19, I only trust the word of God as coming from the eyewitnesses of Jesus and the apostles.

Thanks.

You’ve equated tradition with lessons (teachings, instructions) in your reply. Would it be fair to say then that there is a difference between good traditions and bad traditions?

What I’m getting at is that there is nothing inherently wrong with, or evil about, traditions per se.

Some traditions are good. Some traditions are bad. Some traditions are neutral.

Some traditions are religious in nature. Some traditions are secular in nature.

Some traditions are evil. Some traditions are godly. Some traditions are insignificant.

In short, I don’t think Jesus, the apostles or the early church condemned all traditions, nor even the concept of tradition. It’s the nature of a tradition, it seems to me, which must be evaluated and either accepted or rejected.