beasts in archtype fullfillment

[Mike1111Mike]

****1) With the fullfilment of beats upon the earth, in their 1st or primary fullfilment, such as progression of Israel's captivities as found in the beast fullfilment of Daniel, -we then see Daniel's prophecy of the 70 weeks of 7 leading up to the 1st advent of the Messiah ( Yeshua Ha'Meshiah ) The Lord Christ Jesus, -and events again leading up to the 2nd comming of Christ.****2) And yet with the beasts, we still see parts of the prophecies 1st time fullfillment, were themselves just fullfillment in "type," to set up the future prophecies of the end times, while in other cases we are told of beasts whom "their dominion was taken away, but an extension of life was granted to them.../for an apointed period of time.../ or ( a time and a season )," Dan 7:12****3) So then if we see then that prophecy has 1st time partial fullfillments, and extension of life, -yeilding ongoing partial fullfilments until a final future fullfillment, or just a future fullfillment -we need to look to discern what is actualy stated to occur, and what has and will occur.****4) Now if the power of these kingdoms extended thru the narrow point of the Hour glass of Christ's 1st advent, and continues life beyond that point, leading to a final fullfilment, what can we say about what occurs on earth until the final battles, and final judgment of God??????????****5) How is the extension of life granted to these beasts affecting the world or not, and just what can we see as a result???????? People have said Armageddon and the end is here, time and again!!!!!!! But is there any signs and witness to support final fullfilments, and fullfilments in "Type," or even "Archtype," showing us the signs leading to the very end.****6) Have we not seen that with the partial returns from the Babylonian captivity in 536 and 516 B.C. + 2520 years ( modified as 360/365.2422 ) to yeild 1948, and 1967 - when in 1948 the Fig Tree of Israel was born, and when It grew branches and foliage in 1967 when jerusalem was united, and time is aproaching the end as in the signs of Noah where 1948+120=2068 A.D., or the sign of a prophetic generation being 100 years as 1967+100=2067 A.D., or the 90th psalm being the only psalm written be Moses saying teach us to number our years, 80 if by strength = 1990+80=2070 A.D.,, and we see the time of the end is aproaching. ****7) With the extension of life of the these beasts in Dan 7:12 not come before Dan 11:2 where it says in truth behold 3 more kings are going to arise in Persia, and a 4th.****8) And if Israel was reborn amognst these signs of trials and tribulations, and was born again "In times of trouble," do we see ARCHTYPE fullfillment of these beasts, again showing us the end of time is near, and the 2nd comming of Christ??????????****9) Now if we have indeed witnessed the 4 beasts arive again, then are we not to see all of the "Dress rehersals" of History are comming to an end, and the end times are indeed on their way?????????????*****) Now if we expect let us say for The "One World System" to be the beast which recieves a wound in it's head, be the point when the restrained "Lucifer," is then cast down to Earth as Satan who will become the Antichrist, who will heal the wound of the beast, and thus save the world. And in point of fact the wound to only one of the Heads of the beast which is to be healed, could be a singular aspect disaster such as ecological/economic, or national/World War, but not take the entire One World System down in one shot, so He can heal it. But before this can occur, does a limmited series of the 4 beast's apear in "Archtype fullfillment," to help bring about the pressure that causes One Worldism in the 1st place, say 4 Beast "Archtype Fullfilment" thru the 1900's, during the period when the Fig Tree appears "During Times of Trouble," so as to singal that the Final prophetic fullfillments will occur after the "Archtype" ( Sets ) of fullfillment are over, ****Showing that ( via the prophecies related to the Fig Tree ) that the < Final Conflict(s) > are aproaching, and soon it will all be over.*****) so do we see one of the Final "Archtype," series of 4 beast fullfillments ( a quickening ) occur for example in the 1900's: ????***10) Becuase In Daniel 8: the 2 beats the Ram or king of Persia, and the He-Goat or king of Greece, are the same as the 2nd and 3rd beast of Dan 7: or the Bear with 3 ribs in His mouth, and the Leopard with four heads.*****) Now if the Beasts can be fullfilled in "Archtype," historicaly as more than one ( set of 4 ), then to distinguish the individual "ruler" of one of the sets, I will choose the name of the ruler/ kingdom of their original 1st time historical fullfillment, also as a "Tag" for that particular Beast-Number---within-It's-Set, for example "The King Of Persia, signifying the "Ruler," Beast #2 of a particular ( set of 4 ) fullfillment, say for a set in the 1900's***11) Could not the Ram who could not be opposed, until the beast of 4 heads united as the He-Goat and crushed the previous beast, have Been Adolf Hitler, and the NAZI's -the blackest of evil sorcerrors and magicians of the black arts and death, who when they were dfeated by the allies, the allies broke into the four heads ( as like when Alexander the Great died, and His kingdom was divided into 4 ), and it was the beginning of the cold war,***12)And This Persian king Hitler, called themselves the Aryian master race, where the word is of Persian origin. And if Daniel 11:2 says three more kings of Persia are going to arise, could that not have been the THIRD REICH, for a 4th Persian king is yet to come, when these beasts will not be fullfilled only in "Type." And if this Persian ram is the 3rd reich, and is equal to the 2nd beast of Daniel 7: the Bear with THREE RIBS in it's mouth, could that not also point to the THIRD REICH?????????????***13)For if that were so, than again in "ARCHTYPE," fullfilment, the allies would have to shatter ( the onset of the cold war ), and a terible kingdom arise from the four, with a 10 horns, and a little horn:***14)There was unprecidented intrigue in the Soviet union whereby it's Premiere had to reign in discrace, and return to the politburo, which then also without precident then became 11 in number, so that the 10 horns ( 10 kings without authority of their own ) elected the 11th horn, to become the 8th Premiere of the Soviet Union; The 8th, of the 7, elected by 10 kings without their own authority, and He having been the 11th horn Himself: Gorbachev***15)Now Gorbachev never abandoned Communism, but only wanted to bring reform. He still believes the problem with the world is exclusiveness in nations, exclusiveness in economy, and exclusiveness in religion, and His solution is "A One World Government, One World Economy, and A One World Religion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"***16)And now Gorbachev in "type" is "the beast which was and is not," and has now gone Green, Because now with Global Warming, there is a militant movement perculating ,to force the whole world to go "Green," ( which would not be bad if it were not going to be a disingenuous movement ), where they will need a leader -not like Bush -to force the world go green, in "Type,"***17)And yet I do not believe it yet to be the end, for we will see destructions, and earth changes, and 10 kings will call upon one who "was and is not,"***18)Which is why others now even await the supposed return of Pope John Paul II, as the False Prophet, who is burried in His Trapeziod coffin,signifying the occult ( as is so believed by some )***19)And fear and rumor could run wild. But I think, that even though the "Dress Rehersals for Armageddon," are comming to an end, there is a time comming soon where the nations of the world will gather at Meggido, to go down to Jerusalem!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!***20)So we have to watch and look, and see we understand the signs, like the Demonic NAZi's who though they threw the war so a Hitler said "Do not follow Me, but the one who is to come after Me," near the end in His Bunker. And even though the NAZI's did the darkest of deeds, their is one like a Gorbachev and Pope John Paul II aliance yet to come. God Bless, and Praise God, The Lord Jesus Christ, Has already won these battles, even before they begin!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Mike

 

[Christina]

You have some interesting ideas a lot is true but it seems you have gone the difficult route to find them and have made some errors in you conclusions. We are told the last Generation will be the one that sees Israel restored as a nation.God promises the Generation that wittiness's this event shall not pass before the End and the coming of our Lord. This of course occurred in May,15 1948And is told in the parable of the fig tree. Here is two explanationshParable of the Fig Tree --------------------------------------------------------------------------------PARABLE OF THE FIG TREE(A Parable God tells Us To Learn)------------------------------------------------Everyday its seems we hear or see somthing else about the "END TIMES".We watch to see if God's prophecy's are being played out on the world stage.God tells us that no one knows the hour or day of the return of Christ.However he tells us we should watch and know the season,just as we know when the leaves turn colors and begin to fall,that the seasons are going to change,God tells us to watch for the season of the "End Times"Matthew 24, Mark 13 ,Luke 21, all tell us of the signs of this season,there will be false prophets,wars,rumors of wars,and earthquakesbut these things have always been so how do we know when we are supposed to start watching for this particular season? When being asked of these things Jesus gave a parableLuke 21:29 And he spake to them a parable;Behold the fig tree, and all the trees;Luke29:30 When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selvesthat summer is now nigh at hand.Luke29:31: So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass,know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand.Luke29:32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away,till all be fulfilledA parable is simular to a riddle meaning there is a mystery or hidden meaning in the words. It is saying more than the surface words.So what does this riddle say? It has long been understood by biblical scholars that trees represent"Nations" and the "Fig Tree" represents IsraelSo taking this into account the parable would now read:Behold Israel, and all the NationsWhen they come forth,yea shall know the season is at handSo likewise when you see these things come to pass,know that the kingdom of God is close at handI say unto you,This generation shall not pass away till all things be fufilledNow that we know what the parable says lets inspect it futher. Behold Israel.Israel became a nation,for the first time since Christ's time on May 14,1948 (U.N ratified 1947)NationsThese are the nations that the bible says exsist in the end timesGenerationWhat Generation is it speaking of? the generation that see's Israel become a Nation So we can now see that the Parable of the Fig Tree tells us that the generation that saw the 1948 formation of the state of Israel is the generation that will see the "End Time events and the return of Christ.A generation in the bible is 40 years,70 years,or 120 years.Although we can not completely rule out 120 year generation people in our day do not normally live to 120 years old so it would seem that 40 years or 70 years would be more likely however 40 years has already passed, so by process of elimination we are left with 70 year Generation. God does not say he will wait the full 70 years, only that the generation will not all pass away before the end comes.We are fast aproaching the 70th year May14, 2008 will complete 60 years of the 70 year generation.And the 70 years ends May 14,2018There is another important date that we are approaching that may shed more light on where we stand in the time line.East Jerusalem was part of the so called occupied territories untill the Six Day War of June 5,1967. When Israel finally took position of all of Jerusalam.Which completed the current day state of Israel.In June 2007 Israel will celebrate the 40 year aniversery of the possession of Jerusalam.Forty(40) is an important number in Gods word and often signifies completeness or fullness of time.krissAnd a second explanationhttp://www.christianityboard.com/pa... relates Esau and Ishmael or Iran and Russia.

 

[Mike1111Mike]

Thank You for Your response. I propose My ideas as food for thought, and do not do the thorough and more professional layouts You produce, but I also need to fix My poor layouts when I feel beter. I do not mind corections, as I may not be right on certain points, however there are only but I few I feel I must defend ( due to conviction, even if I could be wrong ), and of cource with new details when I feel neccessary. The O.T. in particular is very crypticaly written, as is the pregnant and compact nature of biblical Hebrew. In the Gen 1: and 2: creation accounts different hebrew words are used for the male and female of the race of adam in both accounts, because they compliment eachother and are not redundant. I believe the words used for male and female in Gen 1: account represent the nature of the inner man of the race of Adam for both the male and female, But due to man's lack of obedience wild speculations arise, such as two creation accounts, which in turn eventualy gave Jewish myth and legend of their being two wives of adam, the 1st Lilith and the second Chia ( Eve ), however with their twisted view ( they have two women, but only one adam ). And the Genesis creation accounts are cryptic in other ways as well, including the fact that the 4th day can be interpreted as the sun and moon being "apointed," rather than created on the 4th day, which can lead into further speculations as to intended meaning and so on and so forth. I feel Biblical prophecy, is equaly as cryptic ( as I posit God's use of Righteous, deniability, in that we only cleary are allowed to see what is neccessary to understand -in light of the fact the lost world are allowed to be blind due to their sins, and are also given over to powerfull dillusions ). But I do feel that the Egyptian captivity took place from 1876 to 1446 B.C., as 1) the bible clearly gives the number of years leading up to dating it in relation to Solomon, 2) clearly states that 30 years of it were for sojurning, and 3) clearly states they were released from captivity after four generations "On the selfsame day," Thereofre I feel clearly defining a prophetic generation as 100 years, thus establishing one usable length of a prophetic generation for God to again make use of in the future. I also feel strongly in relation to the partial returns from the Babylonian captivity in 536 and 516 B.C. and the 2520 ( at 360/365.2422 ) year extentions of the remainder of the 360 years of Ezekiel's captivity ( Ezekiel 430 - Jerimiah 70 ), yields the dates of 1947/1948 and 1967 time frames, because I believe Israel, a secular democratic state, was established in times of troubles, and it is the faithful remnant within Israel only who will propheticaly matter, as I feel it is only the faithfull remnant within Christianity who also propheticaly matter ( when prophecy aplies to them, as opposed to us all in general ). I also strongly believe that any fruit the fig tree would produce would be in relation to the faithfull remnant only, but that the tree was born in 1948, and gave forth it's branches and foliage ( and yes it is nit picking ), in 1967 when East Jerusalem was retaken, and thus the 100 year prophetic generation from 1967 leads to a period up to 2067 ( so that that generation would see all come to pass ), as well as the sign of Noah -would then also have the sidebar warning of 120 years from 1948, I refuse to move on these points. However during WW I, the British and it's other allies fought at Megiddo for the control of the region, including Jerusalem, against the turks (but because the U.S. since it's early interaction with foreign powers, had developed it's "re-establishment movement, to re-establish Israel, it had decided to not be involved in the middle east during WW I -so that Christian Missionaries would not be persecuted in the middle east ). So there was a multinational force during WW I, who already have faught at Meggido for jerusalem - to bring about world events in God's greater design. However this was not the battle of "Armageddon," as it is known when the nations of the world will gather at Meggido to go down to Jerusalem ( but again just involves more "partial" parallels ) And it is these partial and superficial parallels which can confuse the understanding of prophecy, as God does not need to make all clear to a world, in which God does not want it to understand certain things, but rather wants to cause events to unfold, while allways allowing their unfloding to give them an oportunity to repent, even thru ever increasing pressure, And as such we strugle thru prophecy ( as Christianity allways had ), even though God would like us to be faithfull, and to understand what "We need to understand," ( in My opinion ). However WW I and WW II were clearly propheticaly linked, and I am certain as a Biblical "ARCHTYPE" that Hitler was the Ram with two horns in Daniel 8: ( and that the two horns could have represented Germany in WW I and WW II, or a similar assesmnet ) Also in addition to fulfill other ARCHTYPES of the antiChrist ( which Hitler was not, but just one demonic beast player on the stage ), WW II is always figured from when Germany Finaly invaded Poland, and the European Allies declared war on Germany, However Hitler began WW II when in peace for exactly 3 1/2 years from 1936 thru 1939 annexed lands which did not belong to Him from March 1936 to September 1939, Period!!!!!!!!!!! However as a partial fullfillment in "Type," the next half of the 3 1/2 years did not apply to Him ( becuase it would have had to have been in a convoluted construction as from Sept 1939 to March 1943 -where The U.S. as part of the completed head of the 'Allies," would have represtented a continuation of the 7 years from March 1943 thru to 1945 - as the 3rd beast of Daniel, who managed to "put down the 1st 3 horns," and offset the 7 years by 3, thus giving 10 years from 1936 thru to 1946 ) But that interpretation, is not correct, and would have a whole hostof implications, including the fact that we would have to throw out almost everything we thought we knew about the end times prophecies. However "Pattern Recognition," and "Confussion," over prophecy, seems to Me to be a natural consequence of these times, for the sake of the wicked will continue to be wicked, and the blind will continue to be blind. Why must we assume as Christians, that God "Wills," or "Intends," for us to know "Everything," as opposed to "Only what we need to know," or for that matter why should we assume, that we should not understand everything related to prophecy????????????? So it behooves us to complete as much of the picture as possible, including discussing Hitler, and explaining that the 3 1/2 years + 3 1/2 years ( + an additional 3 year covering ), while stunning -needs to be dealt with, to show the increase of double and tripple meanings, in the light of "Type," and "Archtype," fullfilment is dealt with, becuase if the Church falls away so completly as to render itself useless You don't think the ANTICHRIST is going to come along, and say "OH, we defeated Hitler already and His 3.5 + 3.5 + 3 = 7 years/horns, in which 3 were put down, thus extending to 7 more, or a total of 10, and Yea that Gorbachev fellow, was the extention of life of the 11th Horn, but we beat Him, and that resurected John Paul II fellow...." And I am also convinced that the extention of life to the Four beasts, which extended thru and past the "Lense," of Christ's 1st advent, continue to lend their life into the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse -and as such their symbolic "nationhood," does not have to be the same, but SYMBOLIC, I do not expect 1)Babylon, 2)Medo-Persia, 3)Greece, and 4)Rome to be those same nations except as symbolicaly so, And therefore why can not the 3 More, than a 4th king of Persia, whole will then arouse His whole empire against Greece,...and subsequently the kings of the North and South will fight back and forth, until the TRUE king of the North will be revealed to be the ANTICHRIST ( as Per Dan 11: etc.., ), involve Germany representing 3 Reich's as these three kings of Persia, if The 4 Horsmen, and other factors caused these identifications to be transfered into new meaning, as Per God, if God so intends??????????? And that is the Crux of the whole situation: Trying to understand God's prophetic intentions, as N.T. and O.T. prophecy now work together collectively to compliment eachother, and what relation do the 4 horsemen to these 4 beasts of extended life "until the apointed time," actualy mean. I am absolutly convinced Hitler was this beast Bear with 3 ribs/ram with 2 horns, as the Last great Archtype fullfillment of this combined beast description, -Before it's Final fullfillment, So that we can see and refute the 3.5 + 3.5 + 3 means Hitler was the actual antichrist, and our entire prophetic understanding and prophetic edifice we hold so dear, was completely wrong, and the Israel prophecies are all post "70th week," And even though it may seem ridiculous to us, it is what the lost world comes to think, that we should be concerned with also, so the Antichrist won't come along and say "Oh we defeated that Hitler Fellow." And if we think hard on this, it is not funny at all ( not that I am saying anyone said it was ). But I do not believe the 70th week, or the last half of the 70th week ended with WWII, but we have to deal with and teach upon the implications of what did happen, And the NAZI's were litteraly the blackest of black magicians one could possible imagine ( again also underestimated highly so ), So that we should not overlook what the world will come to say and believe!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! God Bless, Mike

 

[Jon-Marc]

This coming May will be 60 years since Israel became a nation again. I can't help but wonder "How Much Longer?" I wrote a song with that title. I long to hear the trumpet sound and the voice of the Arch Angel, and to rise and meet my blessed Lord in the air. "Even so, come, Lord Jesus."